[extropy-chat] Re: Hybrids

Sat Jan 31 16:28:12 UTC 2004

At that point is will not only be genetics but how the switching on and off of
genes.  If one can by encoding parts of the genotype, perhaps in the Major
histocompatibility complex with instructions to suppress or activate just the
genes
required to result in a functional offspring you  may have a method.

The phenotype may be far removed in appearance,  but the fundamental
biochemistry might remain almost identical.  Conversely, to enable survival in
extreme environments the physiology might need to be radically altered, but the
phenotype might remain almost identical outwardly.

We humans  have a mental block when comparing appearance to underlying
functional  traits.
The chemistry of DNA and life-long regulation and de-regulation of genes  still
has much to offer without deviating very  far  from the current genotype.

Resistance to oxidative stress  can result from a few "simple"  changes.
Like plants resistant to multiple herbicides, humans resistant to multiple
physical stressors might be a first step.  The key is to make the gene changes
mesh with the numerous feedback loops not just in biochemistry but also
epigenetic chemistry.  Reproductive capacity is a tertiary consideration. I
think that integrating
functional changes so that they still allow proper reproduction is like adding
the rest of a car to the functional chassis.  Necessary to the "driver", but
not to the basic funtionality of the organism.

You might need  for example , an agent that functions like a  targeted prion
that is designed to go about manually switching on a particular gene.  You also
need a stop mechanism.

Having methods to do virtual and in vivo long term accelerated simulations is
very important to de-bugging a genetic change.  Animal models are of some value
but finding ways to simulate effects over extended periods of time will be
required too.

To go from simply enhancing damage repair, stress damage prevention, spot
tissue regneration  will be a major milestone.  Perhaps the first stage can
increase lifespan to 150 years.  The second stage, major whole body self
regeneration is where
the first really radical extension will happen.  So if that stage can increase
potential
regeneation (" Dr Who style") to perhaps 1000 years, then you have a whole new
window in which to develop the next step , on the fly regeneration and
enhancement cycles.

Studying hybrids is a simple way to visualize the complexity of the task.

Kevin Freels wrote:

> But would they stay seperate for any reasonable length of time? At some
> point, ocean girl and land boy, two star-crossed lovers, are going to fall
> in love. Ocean girl is going to become pregnant and ocean amphibian will be
> born. ...... or ocean baby with land genes hidden, or land baby with ocean
> genes.....
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Grant" <paulgrant999 at hotmail.com>
> To: "'ExI chat list'" <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
> Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2004 2:11 AM
> Subject: RE: [extropy-chat] Re: Hybrids
>
> > Thats an easy one :) people who are land-mammals, and people who are
> > genetically engineered for survival in the ocean.
> > There you go; a split that would lead to two seperate species.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org
> > [mailto:extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org] On Behalf Of Kevin
> > Freels
> > Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 11:05 AM
> > To: sjvans at ameritech.net; ExI chat list
> > Subject: Re: [extropy-chat] Re: Hybrids
> >
> >
> > Given the number of people engaging in farm animal sex, let alone people
> > who appear "different" from themselves, I hardly see how humans could
> > ever split into different species unless there was absolutely no contact
> > between two groups for hundreds of thousands of years. There would also
> > have to be several changes in environment that kept the two isolated
> > places changing in different ways. Heck, Bonobos and Chimps are
> > seperated by 3 million years.
> >
> > Assuming we were able to keep our technology, I have trouble envisioning
> > an advanced civilization capable of altering its own evolution that
> > wasn;t also constantly intermixing.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <sjvans at mailhost.mil.ameritech.net>
> > To: <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
> > Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 12:32 PM
> > Subject: Re: [extropy-chat] Re: Hybrids
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > From: Robert J. Bradbury bradbury at aeiveos.com
> > >
> > > >The above discussion suggests that there would possibly be three
> > > >potential civilization cores -- those centered around nuclear
> > > >vessels, those centered around nuclear power reactors and those
> > > >centered around hydroelectric power centers.
> > >
> > > Huh?  I am getting into this late, but could someone explain to me how
> > this
> > > hypothetical "extinction level event" would wipe out fossil fuels?
> > > Coal mines and oil fields are 19th and very early 20th century
> > technology...much
> > > easier to maintain and preserve than nuclear power plants.  With a
> > > hypothetically much reduced population, known reserves and even stored
> >
> > > supplies would last a very long time.  I'd much rather try my hand at
> > > distilling straight gasoline from crude or making producer gas from
> > > coal than refuel a nuclear power plant.
> > >
> > > sjv
> > >
> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
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> > >
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