[extropy-chat] damien's psi book

[Mike Lorrey]

--- Adrian Tymes <wingcat at pacbell.net> wrote:

> --- spike <spike66 at comcast.net> wrote:
> > If we can, even in theory, exist as uploads, then 
> > someone somewhere and somewhen in the universe has 
> > already done so, for the big bang was a long time
> > ago, 
> > the universe is ancient, but humanity, which appears
> > 
> > within centuries or possibly just decades of 
> > uploading, is recent.
> 
> Here's one place where the chain breaks down.  See
> Drake's equation, and the debates surrounding it,
> for reasons why we very well could be the first
> technologically advanced civilization in the universe.

On the contrary, the Drake equation has been getting a drumming the
past few years as the number of extrasolar planets rises, as martian
fossil meteorites are found (and solid evidence of water is found on
Mars) along with subsurface oceans on not only Europa but Ganymede as
well, it is clear that a) life is common wherever planets allow it, b)
planets are common, and given how young our solar system is the
supposition we are the first techno civilization in this galaxy is
strained, the idea we are first in the whole universe is impossible.

> 
> > Step 6:  If someone somewhere and somewhen created
> > a machine capable of simulating sentience, then the
> > natural thing to do would be to wander about the
> > universe looking for perishable sentience to upload
> > before it expires.
> 
> Here's another.  There is no obvious, compelling
> reason to do this.  A species could certainly do it,
> but said species could as well be looking to enhance
> its own civilizations by adding each new race's
> cultural (or biological and technological, as in a
> certain famous example) distinctiveness to its own.
> Instead of uploading into simulations, said species
> would upload newcomers into galactic or universal
> civilization.  Or, again, it could simply pursue its
> own agenda safely away from any place life could
> exist; maybe it would monitor for and lock away any
> potential threats on life-bearing worlds, or maybe it
> wouldn't even bother.
> 
> > Step 7:  If we exist in a simulation as uploads,
> > that sim must be running on some meta-mechanical
> > device
> > of some unimaginable sort, one that cannot, in
> > principle,
> > produce *perfectly* random stochastic processes. 
> > Even
> > meta-mechanical devices are mechanical devices
> > still.
> 
> This assumes you know the physics of the world
> running the sim.  Maybe they can have perfectly
> randomness, and the mechanical non-randomness is an
> artifact of the sim?

You are forgetting the turtles. More than one turtle per universe means
a veritable plethora of turtlesque universes.

=====
Mike Lorrey
Vice-Chair, 2nd District, Libertarian Party of NH
"Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom.
It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."
                                      -William Pitt (1759-1806) 
Blog: http://www.xanga.com/home.aspx?user=Sadomikeyism


		
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