[extropy-chat] Huygens: First visitor to Titan

[Mike Lorrey]

--- Amara Graps <Amara.Graps at ifsi.rm.cnr.it> wrote:

> 
> Mike Lorrey:
> >One does need to ask what the value of a data minute
> >of particle and field data is worth versus photography of planets
> and
> >moons, radar mapping, etc.
> 
> Since 99% of the universe is in a plasma state, I think that the
> particle and fields data is quite valuable. Those of us, on top
> of rocks such as this, live in special conditions.

Yes, but 'quite valuable' is a meaningless term. HOW valuable, in, say,
dollars per megabyte of data, is it?

> 
> >As for Huygens, maybe it is because of the age of the probes, but
> >after seeing the pictures from the Mars Rovers, the miniscule low
> >resolution pictures sent back by Huygens are a little
> >disappointing.
> 
> Sorry, you are so disappointed in Huygens. My view is that it was
> an engineering and scientific achievment like no other in the
> planetary sciences (you might look at your favorite Mars
> missions, and note the failures). It  also looks like you have
> made your judgement based on zero of the data from the 
> other five instruments.

Well, no, I'm not making a judgement about all of the data, I'm making
a judgement about the video data, which is of a disappointingly low
resolution. I hear that one reason for this is the loss of one of the
data channels, according to one article I read.

> 
> Re: Image data. 
> 
> 1) You are judging alot from 3/350 of the visible data you have
> seen at the web sites.
> 
> 2) I wonder why you are so focused on electromagnetic wave data
> only from the visible part of the spectrum. Do you realize how
> tiny is that part of the spectrum?

I'm not, so it's too bad you are making that assumption. I've listened
to the microphone data, and to the radar record, which is likely going
to be valuable in providing more geological/geographical data.

What I am asking for from folks like yourself who make have better
information, is an objective valuation of exactly what such data is
really worth, and, particularly, not a lot of defensiveness and
evasion.

Of course, as an American, I'm not a european taxpayer, so I personally
didn't put any money into Huygens, but I am interested in determining
if the european taxpayers got their moneys worth of science. $2.5
million per data minute (compared to less than $800.00 per data minute
for Cassini and the Mars Rovers) seems so significantly outside the
range of other missions that it should be a point of concern for any
european taxpayer group. As recipients of european tax dollars, ESA
staff should be happy to demonstrate in quantitative ways what sort of
ROI they are providing to their benefactors, if only to keep the money
coming for future missions.
 
> 
> >Okay, then my previous calculation makes Cassini's average cost per
> >data minute on a par with the Mars Rovers. If so, such a valuation
> >demolishes the idea of "Better, Faster, Cheaper" that Sean O'Keefe
> >promoted for many years: The Mars Rovers are no cheaper, in data
> >dollars, than Cassini, which is arguably the most 'expensive' space
> >probe in history. 
> 
> Cassini was never part of the 'smaller-faster-cheaper' missions,
> that initiative came ten years after Cassini's conception.

I never said it was. In fact, if you actually read what I said, you
would see that I was contrasting Cassini against the Mars Rovers, which
were part of the 'smaller-faster-cheaper' missions. Based on data
dollars, there does not seem to be a higher ROI on
'smaller-faster-cheaper' missions than on big budget missions like
Cassini.

However, contrasting the Mars Rovers against Huygens, there is a
significant difference of several magnitudes.

=====
Mike Lorrey
Vice-Chair, 2nd District, Libertarian Party of NH
"Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom.
It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."
                                      -William Pitt (1759-1806) 
Blog: http://www.xanga.com/home.aspx?user=Sadomikeyism

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