[extropy-chat] qualia

[Samantha Atkins]

On Nov 28, 2005, at 4:26 PM, gts wrote:

> On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 15:07:36 -0500, Dirk Bruere  
> <dirk.bruere at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>> Even if that is true, it still leaves open the question of the  
>> communication between matter and intelligence such that qualia are  
>> appreciated.
>> If every bit of information processed results in a speck of
>> consciousness/qualia or whatever, what is the mechanism that  
>> 'sees' it and reports it to other?
>>
>
> My view here is similar to Brent's.
>
> Either awareness arises as some new magical property out of unaware  
> matter (emergentism), or else it is present in all matter (pan- 
> psychism). I reject the former and accept the latter. Brent calls  
> this "phenomenal properties of matter". I believe we are proposing  
> the same idea, more or less.

Neither magic or pan-psychism is required.  Awareness can be had by  
proper programming in brains.  It is not that terribly difficult.

>
> I think neurons in the brain experience a color when the light  
> stimulus makes an imprint in them. We don't know the exact  
> mechanism, but obviously it involves physical changes within or  
> among neurons. In my view that physical change *is* awareness.  
> Furthermore I think awareness happens whenever any physical object  
> is affected by any stimulus.
>

We know enough about the visual subsystem to know that light itself  
doesn't make an imprint on neurons.  Awareness requires a self-model,  
a bit of recursive wiring/programming.  It is pointless to lean  
toward believing awareness is synonymous with cause and effect.

> Higher organisms like humans experience the world and also  
> *reflect* on their experience. I suppose this involves other  
> neurons observing the changes made to the neurons above. This makes  
> us not only aware, but self-aware. This is consciousness, not to be  
> confused with awareness.

If we are talking about qualia then this reflection is essential.

>
> The key point here is that experience is in the initial imprint. An  
> organism can have experiences without the ability to reflect on  
> them, as is probably the case for example with insects. A brain  
> without the ability to reflect on experience would be analogous to  
> a camera: aware but not self-aware and not conscious. In this  
> respect insects are similar to robotic cameras equipped with some  
> programming.

Then this is not qualia.

>
> If my insight here is correct then strong AI becomes more feasible.  
> It should be possible to build a machine out of inanimate materials  
> that experiences qualia. If the machine is modeled on and  
> functionally equivalent to the brain then it will experience  
> qualia, and seem to itself to be as alive as you and me.
>

All life came from and is composed of inanimate materials!  So  
obviously it is possible to construct something that has awareness  
from inanimate materials.

- samantha