[extropy-chat] >H pleasure (was: MOVIE: "The Singularity")

[Emlyn]

On 28/09/05, Samantha Atkins <sjatkins at mac.com> wrote:
>
> On Sep 27, 2005, at 7:21 PM, Emlyn wrote:
>
> > On 28/09/05, Adrian Tymes <wingcat at pacbell.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Which is not to say it won't be a problem.  I recall Natasha's
> >> description, from several years ago, of telepathic intimacy.  Things
> >> like that, while not absolute, could well prov to be powerful enough
> >> addictions to essentially cause many to vegetate for long enough
> >> periods as to cause near-term resource shortages.  (Even a
> >> self-replicating system needs a certain minimum resource base to
> >> survive, especially if a large part of itself has ceased
> >> self-replicating or doing any other productive labor yet still
> >> requires
> >> support.)
> >>
> >
>
> I don't see it as a real problem, especially for >human folks able to
> observe and tinker with their own workings.  Such addictions would be
> noticed and corrected.  Anyone who has traveled a hedonistic path for
> very long comes to see pleasure for pleasure sake as rather boring
> sooner or later as long as heavy physiological addictions are not a
> significant issue.    Most of us learn there is more to do of
> interest than eat bon bons all day.
>
> > Some days, I have great trouble working out how that differs from
> > right now. Currently, there seem to be more than enough raw resources
> > to go around, with very little of the population working on anything
> > related to producing them (eg: 1% of workers are agricultural workers
> > in the US, 10% I think are in manufacturing, remembering from "Rise of
> > the Creative Class" by Richard Florida).
> >
>
> With modern agricultural methods more than 1% is not necessary.  Come
> MNT we may not need hardly any human workers to produce all the food
> and other material needs of all of humanity.  Does that mean than all
> human beings are useless?  Is the only meaning to existence to work
> at agriculture or manufacturing?  Do you think so?
>
> > Whereas about 60% are service industry, about 30% are creative class
> > (I think, my numbers might be out, for instance that all adds up to
> > 101%!)
> >
>
>
> > Might we not view large chunks of the service industry and the
> > creative class workers as producing nothing tangible? I do wonder
> > whether much of modern work is the market inventing make-work to keep
> > the money flowing.
> >
>
> Performing services for one another is producing nothing real?  How
> so?  Is the only thing of value a material object?  What of
> information, innovation, new ideas, exploration, entertainment,
> expanding insight, understanding,  ability, enjoyment?
>
> What makes life meaningful to you?  There is no real "from the
> outside" to judge from.
>
> - samantha
>
>

Exactly! I agree with your point of view. So now apply that back to
Adrian's comments regarding the telepathically interlinked and them
looking like vegetables from the outside. What's going on on the
inside? Is it of value? Similarly for uploads or AIs living in purely
virtual universes in the future. From the outside, it looks like a
computer humming away. From the inside, something more interesting is
happening.

--
Emlyn

http://emlynoregan.com   * blogs * music * software *


--
Emlyn

http://emlynoregan.com   * blogs * music * software *