[ExI] Change of thought (was Just curious, it's not natural!)

spike spike66 at comcast.net
Wed Sep 5 01:42:18 UTC 2007

> -----Original Message-----
> From: extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org [mailto:extropy-chat-
> bounces at lists.extropy.org] On Behalf Of PJ Manney
> Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 12:12 PM
> To: ExI chat list
> Subject: Re: [ExI] Change of thought (was Just curious, it's not natural!)
> On 9/3/07, spike <spike66 at comcast.net> wrote:
> > If gay marriage becomes legal, would that problem be worse?  Could a
> sick
> > rich person marry her grandson's girlfriend ...
> The key word you used is "theoretically."
> Spike, there are only 800,000 same sex couples in the entire country.
> Where's the huge rip off of the system by the straight couples?  When
> my retirement money is being pilfered by every straight Tom, Dick and
> Henrietta, then I'll be worried.  Emlyn's right.  This is a non-issue.
>  Gays deserve the same rights straights get.
> And I thought you were a math wiz...  ;-)
> PJ

PJ, the ripoffs I was describing have little or nothing to do with gay or
straight, so the actual number of gay couples is irrelevant.  The
grandmother who marries her grandson's girlfriend is presumed straight.  She
goes into a fake marriage to provide her new spouse (and presumably her
grandson) with a pension that lasts their lifetimes.  

These sorts of scams could occur already, but perhaps allowing gay marriage
would double the opportunities, or possibly more than double them.  Consider
for instance that an elderly woman would likely feel more comfortable with a
young woman living in her home than she would with a young man.  If grandma
entered the arrangement in exchange for the young woman providing elderly
care, then both women benefit.  Society pays dearly.  You and I pay for
that.  When we need that social security, it might be bankrupt for paying
off our younger fellow citizens who married an elderly (and long since
perished) person in their 20s.

As to the question of how this is relevant to gay marriage, it seems to me
that opening this door invites this sort of abuse.  We know that elderly men
often marry young women, and we can easily imagine what is in it for both.
But we do not see elderly women marrying young men.  If this world's
societies decide to allow same sex marriage, it allows or even invites
elderly women and young women to play this game ever more to their own
advantage, for grandma would surely be unopposed to her wife having male

The debate seems to be chronically sidetracked on irrelevant sexual morality
issues.  Totally beside the point are these.  What really does matter, PJ is
what it costs.  I don't care (no one should care) what people do with whom
in their bedrooms.  But I care bigtime if it contributes in any way to
plundering my pension fund.

Seems to me that Europe, Canada, Japan, and Australia would face a similar
(if not more severe) problem, for all the same reasons.


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