[ExI] War drives innovation

Jeff Davis jrd1415 at gmail.com
Tue Oct 11 17:52:24 UTC 2011


Welcome to the list, Tara.  Please stay around.  Please post more.
Particularly when threads like this summon up the usual ideological
blather.  I do not have the patience -- nor the time to take from more
constructive pursuits -- to push back against (ie vainly attempt to
re-educate) those drowning in ancient/modern tribalist hoohah.  Your
post -- and Stefano's -- manifest Occam-approved elegance in their
parsing of reality.

One sentence(plus a fragment) is all it takes:

"...governments exist primarily for two purposes: to enable one small
group of people to exploit a larger group of people and to enable that
same small group of people to protect that same larger group of people
from being exploited or destroyed in a presumably even more awful way
by some other small group of people. An extortion racket...."

Excise from the above, "... or destroyed in a presumably more awful
way..."  and you approach perfection.  " destroyed" is hysterical
fear-mongering, and bullsh*t, but nevertheless possibly the single
most effective method of political manipulation.  "They're comin' to
get you.  They're gonna kill you after they rape your women in front
of you."  "Wipe you off the map!  Drive you into the sea!"
"...presumably..."  Yeah, right,... if you're weak-minded and ignorant
of history.

Conquerors, with rare exceptions , conquer for the profit in it.  They
"destroy" neither the sheeple nor any sheeple herder willing to
cooperate.

War as a business model, is the cancer on Capitalism.

Anyway, thank you Tara, I've got your back.

Best, Jeff Davis

   ... those of us who are
   heartbroken from never-ending grief
   caused by never-ending death caused
   by never-ending war are sick of...
   never-ending lies.
                     Missy Comely Beattie






Your

On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 7:51 AM, Tara Maya <tara at taramayastales.com> wrote:
> You've put your finger on an interesting paradox. As a good Hobbesian, I believe that governments exist primarily for two purposes: to enable one small group of people to exploit a larger group of people and to enable that same small group of people to protect that same larger group of people from being exploited or destroyed in a presumably even more awful way by some other small group of people. An extortion racket, in other words, but not dispensable, since the threat of destruction without a government is very real.
>
> However, the paradox is that for the past five hundred years (probably more) wars have always been won by the combatant with the strongest economy, and usually that has meant the freest economy. Liberal England vs centralized Napoleonic France, the capitalist democratic Allies vs. the National Socialists, etc. The technological and financial inventions that made the more liberal governments stronger did NOT come from the government, but in time of war, WERE put to good use by the government.
>
> Tara Maya
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2011, at 6:11 AM, BillK wrote:
>
>> A Wired article has reminded me that it is governments & war that
>> drives technological innovation.
>>
>> <http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/10/gadgets-the-pentagon-made/?pid=814&viewall=true>
>>
>> Gadgets the Pentagon Made — From the Microwave to the New iPhone
>>    * By Spencer Ackerman and Noah Shachtman    October 6, 2011
>> -------------------
>>
>> When you add in the huge wave of technology that came out of WWII, it
>> is really obvious.
>>
>> Sure, inventions are made by genius individuals, but they sre usually
>> working for the government, or for organisations funded by government
>> money.
>> 'Markets' are just hobbyists tinkering at the edges in comparison,
>> selling stuff the government invented for them.
>>
>>
>> BillK
>>
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>
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