[ExI] repercieve the economy [was: Engineering]

[BillK]

On Thu, Dec 20, 2012 at 1:21 PM,  ablainey wrote:
> I have been thinking about this for years now and it is becoming every more
> realistic when looking at our current economic system. Rather than try to
> find ways to raise money for future energy solutions. I think we need to
> re-evaluate the way we perceive the problem and change our economy
> accordingly.
> We are arguing in terms of MWh gained per $ spent. When we should be arguing
> in terms of energy outlay per energy return. MWh out vs MWh in.
> If the economy were shifted to an energy backed standard instead of a
> tangible commodity like Gold. It would be easier to see what pays for itself
> and yields a profit.
> A solar satellite would then have a substantial energy cost value instead of
> a $ value. It may cost 200MWh to produce and launch the thing and have an
> estimated return of 30000MWh during its expected lifetime. (random figures)
>
<snip>
>
> I just think that in a world where energy is the number one commodity, we
> need to start using it as our global unit of currency. Doing so is the only
> way to increase our efficiency as a species and will drive us to the stars
> as it will be the only realistic method of long term economic growth.
>


I think what you are talking about is EROEI (energy return on energy invested).
Unfortunately this leads to the 'Energy Trap' that we are currently
experiencing.

Quote:
In its early days, oil frequently yielded an EROEI in excess of 100:1,
meaning that 1% or less of the energy contained in a barrel of oil had
to be expended to deliver that barrel of oil. Not a bad bargain. Oil
production today more typically has an EROEI around 20:1, while tar
sands and oil shale tend to be about 5:1 and 3:1, respectively.
-------

An EROEI reduction on this scale leads to economic recession.
And it is called a trap because our civilisation has to spend more
resources to get energy than we get back in return.

We need a new source of 'free' energy very soon before we no longer
have the resources available to develop new energy sources.

Quote:
Politically, the Energy Trap is a killer. In my lifetime, I have not
witnessed in our political system the adult behavior that would be
needed to buckle down for a long-term goal involving short-term
sacrifice.  Or at least any brief bouts of such maturity have not been
politically rewarded.  I’m not blaming the politicians. We all scream
for ice cream. Politicians simply cater to our demands. We tend to
vote for the candidate who promises a bigger, better tomorrow—even if
such a path is untenable.
----------


See:
<http://physics.ucsd.edu/do-the-math/2011/10/the-energy-trap/>
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EROEI>


BillK