[ExI] Bringing new life to dead matter

[Kelly Anderson]

On Mon, Jun 4, 2012 at 5:34 PM, The Avantguardian
<avantguardian2020 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Kelly Anderson <kellycoinguy at gmail.com>
>> To: ExI chat list <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
>> Cc:
>> Sent: Sunday, June 3, 2012 4:28 AM
>> Subject: Re: [ExI] Bringing new life to dead matter
>
>> Plants have no sense organs (maybe venus fly traps?) for the most
>> part... without sensory organs, without a nervous system, how would
>> you get perception? What is doing the perceiving?
>
> I think you are underestimating plants, Kelly. Sunflowers are are called that because they twist to follow the sun. The phenomenon is called heliotropism and cannot occur unless the sunflower senses the sun somehow. Phototropism, geotropism, and of course venus flytraps catching prey all require senses. On a cellular level plants do almost everything animals do just at a slower pace, since they don't have the quick access to large amounts of energy that eating thy neighbor affords. Here's a link. There's a journal article at the bottom of the page for video non-watchers.
>
> http://www.whataplantknows.com/home/plant-senses

This is a compelling argument. I particularly liked the kid's science
project. Nice one. I think I did underestimate plants. Still,
consciousness?

>> All chemicals work
>> with information, but informational processing doesn't equal
>> consciousness. Most people don't consider computers conscious (yet)
>> but they process way more information than a plant.
>
> Last I heard human brains process information electrochemically with chemical neurotransmitters. Plants are a network of living cells. Nervous systems are a network of living cells. The key difference could simply be connectivity. Neurons are each connected to more other neurons than plant cells which are simply connected to the neighboring cells they touch.
>

And speed. Speed is always part of the measure of intelligence.

> One possible way to define a "unit" of consciousness is through an environmental sensory-behaviorial feedback loop. For example a simple thermostat might be considered conscious in a rudimentary way: It senses the temperature of it's environment and then turns on or off the HVAC system accordingly. Computers sense and respond to their users unless one gives them senses other than a keyboard, then they can be programmed to respond to other stimuli. So I guess what I am asking is that if consiousness is *not* information processing then what else might it be?

OK... maybe I'm defining consciousness more in terms of "self
awareness"... I don't know how self awareness is related to
consciousness, but when I think of consciousness, that's sort of the
kind of thing that pops into my head. And no, I do not think that a
switch is self aware. Plants? I dunno.

-Kelly