[ExI] spanish train wreck

[BillK]

On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 6:28 PM, spike  wrote:
> Thanks BillK, and this makes my point: from a controls engineering
> perspective, this is an easy problem, easy, easy.  The GPS can be aboard the
> train, with redundancy, that make up a control system that is actually a
> superset of what would be needed to assist a train driver.  We know the
> argument that automated controls cause the human operators to neglect some
> aspects of control, since the driver has the option to turn on the automated
> system.  What I propose is something more robust: an automated GPS-based
> maximum speed control that the driver cannot override, making it physically
> impossible for her to defeat the maximum speed control even if she decides
> to intentionally crash the train.  Then a few moments of inattention are
> irrelevant.
>
> Similar systems could easily be installed in airliners.  We had an airline
> crash locally, a Korean flight crew came in too slow and whacked the tail on
> the threshold, slaying two and wrecking a perfectly healthy aircraft.  The
> passengers aboard who were experienced at coming into San Francisco knew
> several miles out that the plane was coming in too low and far too slow.
> There is a case where the passengers knew more than the two yahoos guiding
> the aircraft.
>
> Automation of that glide path control would fix that problem.
>
>

Quote:
With a system such as the European Train Control System (ETCS), a
driver would not be able to break the speed limit.
-----------

The ETCS system applied to most of that line, but at the end of a high
speed straight run, just before the bend the train switched to an
older track with an older warning system. So at the very time that a
drastic speed cut was required, ETCS no longer applied.
It may be that the driver thought that ETCS still applied, so he was
casual about the speed limits, or maybe the older warning system
failed, or maybe the driver ignored the warning or maybe he didn't
have time to react.

Eventually the fail safe ETCS will be installed everywhere.

Re the SF plane crash, I understand the automated glide path control
system was switched off by the airport for maintenance so the pilots
had to fly the plane in themselves.

The trouble with giving humans systems that protect them from errors
is that the humans then rely on the automated systems and don't look
out for themselves. That's why drivers follow gps instructions to
drive into rivers and along railway tracks.

BillK