[ExI] Quantum consciousness, quantum mysticism, and transhumanist engineering
brent.allsop at gmail.com
Thu Mar 30 20:11:47 UTC 2017
On Wed, Mar 29, 2017 at 9:31 PM, Stathis Papaioannou <stathisp at gmail.com>
If the system is designed to detect real glutamate, and you change it so
> that it is not detecting real glutamate, then of course it will fail in its
> job to detect real glutamate. But that is the wrong question to ask. We are
> discussing qualia. Your theory is that glutamate is directly and uniquely
> responsible for red qualia, and therefore if the glutamate goes, the red
> qualia will go. What I am trying to show is that the glutamate can go but
> the red qualia will remain. Therefore, the glutamate cannot be directly and
> uniquely responsible for the red qualia.
It's all the same. And remember, you need to stop making the mistake,
which you have done again here, that when I use the term glutamate, I am
talking about real glutamate. You made the claim that in your neuro
substituted system, that it would have qualitative distinguishing
abilities. For you, every time I say glutamate, don't think of it as real
glutamate, you need think of it as if it was whatever it is, in your
system, which is able to be qualitatively distinquished.
Part of our consciousness is a real detection system of whatever is the
neural correlate of redness. So, if we are talking about qualia, we are
talking about consciously detecting the real thing, and distinguishing it
from greenness. That's what consciousness is, it is a detector of
qualities of nature of something in our brain. If you neurosubstitute out
this ability to do this detection (either subjectively or objectively),
your argument becomes invalid.
Try to do the neuro substitution on the described glutamate detection
system. If you do it in the same way, your conclusion must be that real
glutamate can't be responsible for whatever qualities you are detecting
about it. The same way for any kind of functional redness quality. When
you do your simplistic neuro substitution, you must conclude that no such
functionality can exist.
But, if, in your system, you include something that has detectable
qualities, and a way to detect them (either subjectively or objectively)
there are no impossible problems, and there is a real part of nature that
has a redness quality, without it being some kind of: "A miracle happens
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