[ExI] What is "Elemental Redness"?

[Gadersd]

> If you wanna be a famous philosopher, all you have to do is make even infinitesimal progress along those lines. Because no one has yet.

I loathe philosophy and would be upset if anyone considered me a philosopher. However, I am working on the “hard problem" and will probably write a book on it if no one else gets to it first. No spoilers, sorry!

> On May 1, 2023, at 4:05 PM, Darin Sunley via extropy-chat <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org> wrote:
> 
> "Systematically bridg[ing] between [material] physical and [immaterial] mental characteristics" is the literal expression of Chalmers' "Hard Problem" of consciousness.
> 
> If you wanna be a famous philosopher, all you have to do is make even infinitesimal progress along those lines. Because no one has yet.
> 
> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 1:34 PM Gadersd via extropy-chat <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org <mailto:extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>> wrote:
>> it's a very odd sort of causation where the physical properties of the presumptive proximate cause have nothing to do with the characteristics of the caused phenomena.
> 
> It would be better to say “seem to have nothing…” Not being aware of a connection does not imply that there isn’t a way to systematically bridge between physical and mental characteristics.
> 
>> On May 1, 2023, at 1:26 PM, Darin Sunley via extropy-chat <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org <mailto:extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>> wrote:
>> 
>> Qualia certainly correlate to physical reality, but declaring causation there seems like a bit of a stretch - at least a begging of the question of materialism.
>> 
>> it's a very odd sort of causation where the physical properties of the presumptive proximate cause have nothing to do with the characteristics of the caused phenomena.
>> 
>> On Mon, May 1, 2023, 10:46 AM Ben Zaiboc via extropy-chat <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org <mailto:extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>> wrote:
>> 
>> On 01/05/2023 17:05, Will Steinberg answered:
>> > It means, I think, "the conformation of physical reality that produces 
>> > the red quale, on the layer of physical reality that is responsible 
>> > for qualia"
>> 
>> 
>> So, a brain?
>> 
>> A brain is 'Elemental Redness'??
>> 
>> I'm reading "conformation of physical reality" as meaning "arrangement 
>> of stuff", and "the layer of physical reality that is responsible for 
>> qualia" as "the organisational level of matter that gives rise to 
>> subjective experiences", i.e. (as far as we know) neural circuits, in a 
>> brain.
>> 
>> I see no reason to use the word 'elemental' for that. In fact it's 
>> wrong. This is far from elemental.
>> 
>> If I'm on the wrong track (which seems likely), well, I did ask for 
>> "simple terms".
>> 
>> Ben
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