<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Just a quick point about the Depression:<div>Hoover's policies weren't really a problem (though I don't think they helped any). The Federal Reserve turned what would have been an average recession into the greatest economic disaster in history, by severely and artificially restricting credit. It did the exact opposite of what it "should" have done (that is, they made it worse). Massive restriction on the money supply reduced bank liquidity, causing some failures, which caused runs (which couldn't be dealt with because of the low liquidity), and on and on. Ben Bernanke has studied the Depression extensively and is considered an expert on the subject, and he said at a talk he gave a couple years back "We did it, we're sorry, and we won't let it happen again," referring to the Great Depression. Laissez-faire didn't have anything really to do with the Depression, it was the Fed which created that catastrophe.</div><div><div><div>On Nov 7, 2009, at 2:46 PM, Michael LaTorra wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div>Hi Spike,</div> <div>In our system of tripartite government structure, our presidents do not wield the same unchecked power that the Chinese leaders do. The US Congress (mostly lawyers) and the Supereme Court (entirely lawyers) can block, undo, or dillute whatever a president proposes to do.</div> <div> </div> <div>In the case of President Carter, we had a man who understood the long-term energy problem and tried to take steps to avert it. He had solar panels installed on the roof of the White House. </div> <div>"In 1977, Carter convinced the Democratic Congress to create the United States Department of Energy (DoE) with the goal of conserving energy. Carter also signed the National Energy Act (NEA) and the Public Utilities Regulatory Policy Act (PURPA). The purpose of these watershed laws was to encourage energy conservation and the development of national energy resources, including renewables such as wind and solar energy." (from Wikipedia.org)</div> <div> </div> <div>In the case of President Hoover, we had a man who eschewed the engineer's penchant for design and process control, opting instead for minimal government the time of the Great Depression, when precisely the opposite was needed. Hoover acted too-little like an engineer when he most needed to.</div> <div>"President Hoover's stance on the economy was based largely on volunteerism. From before his entry to the presidency, he was a proponent of the concept that public-private cooperation was the way to achieve high long-term growth. Hoover feared that too much intervention or coercion by the government would destroy individuality and self-reliance, which he considered to be important American values. Both his ideals and the economy were put to the test with the onset of The Great Depression. At the outset of the Depression, Hoover claims in his memoirs that he rejected Treasury Secretary Mellon's suggested "leave-it-alone" approach. Critics, such as liberal economist Paul Krugman, who wrote <em>The Conscience of a Liberal</em>, contend that Hoover shared Mellon's laissez-faire viewpoint." (from Wikipedia.org) <br> </div> <div>Regards,</div> <div>Mike<br></div> <div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 12:04 PM, spike <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:spike66@att.net">spike66@att.net</a>></span> wrote:<br> <blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">...On Behalf Of Michael LaTorra<br>...<br> <div class="im"><br> I'd like to see more scientists and engineers in our government,<br>rather than the lawyers and bankers who control the United States of Goldman<br>Sachs.<br><br> Regards,<br> Mike LaTorra<br> <br><br><br></div>Mike I would agree in principle, but our experience with it so far has been<br>mostly bad. We have had two presidents which could properly be credited<br>with a background in engineering and sciences: Herbert Hoover and Jimmy<br> Carter. Both were failures.<br><font color="#888888"><br>spike<br></font> <div> <div></div> <div class="h5"><br><br><br><br><br>_______________________________________________<br>extropy-chat mailing list<br><a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a><br><a href="http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat" target="_blank">http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat</a><br> </div></div></blockquote></div><br> _______________________________________________<br>extropy-chat mailing list<br><a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a><br>http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat<br></blockquote></div><br></div><br><br><div apple-content-edited="true"> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>Joshua Job</div><div><a href="mailto:nanite1018@gmail.com">nanite1018@gmail.com</a></div><div><br></div></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"> </div><br></body></html>