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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org [mailto:extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Dave Sill<br><b><span style='color:#1F497D'>>>…</span></b></span> Almost by definition, real<span style='color:#1F497D'> </span>intelligence has to be something we do not understand. So we keep raising<br>the bar whenever necessary<span style='color:#1F497D'>… spike</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>>…</span>Sorry, no, that's not it at all. Real intelligence is the ability to learn, to understand, to make inferences<span style='color:#1F497D'>…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>(1) to learn, (2) to understand, (3) to make inferences. Two of these have been accomplished and one is difficult to define. A chess program which keeps a memory of which openings it tried and how the game ended, then makes adjustments to its own play is an example of (1) learning. Done. (3) Making inferences (depending on how it is defined) is how Watson operates when playing Jeopardy. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>Two down, one to go. (2) To understand. Hmmm, to understand. Well you might have me on that one. I would be tempted to point to humans who clearly do not understand. I don’t understand a lot of things that others get: human emotions for instance. To argue that (2) to understand is a necessary requisite for intelligence requires further definition.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>>…</span> We may not understand the process today, but I don't think it's beyond our comprehension<span style='color:#1F497D'>…</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Agreed. I argue that it may be remarkably difficult to recognize intelligence if we see it. We may not understand understanding.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>>…</span>BTW, where's this chat-room Eliza that passes the Turing test?<span style='color:#1F497D'> –</span>Dave<span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I don’t know. Does anyone have that? Last time I went looking for it online, it was gone. It’s been at least 6 years ago. A professor rigged up a specialized version of Eliza and set it to go into a teen chat room. His reasoning is that most people who went to college in the 70s or 80s probably played with Eliza, but those who were born after about 1985 might not have even heard of it. Sure enough, most of the teens chatted away with it for a while before becoming suspicious. Many of those who did figure it out did so because the responses were so fast. A lot of the entries were “Damn you type fast.”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>One particular discussions went on for over 50 minutes. The participant apparently had no idea he was conversing with software. He definitely spilled some of what I would call innermost thoughts. Hey I did that too back in 1980, but I knew it was just a game.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Some argued this was in a sense a successful Turing Test, others argued it doesn’t count since many of the participants did not know computers could converse, or simulate conversation.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The guy who posted all that stuff may have realized it wasn’t quite legitimate and apparently took it down, but there may be references to it somewhere, or quotes from that site.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>It’s been long enough we could probably pull the same gag again with a new set of innocents.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Anyone here have that, or a reference to it?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>spike<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></body></html>