Kevin,<div>OWS is not against productions of goods in general.</div><div>Goods can be produced in many different ways. Capitalism is not necessary.</div><div>I have posted videos showing that creativity in his highest form is not motivated by money.</div>
<div>In the lab were I work people do very creative work, putting hours at night and the weekend without making millions of dollars out of this.</div><div>A lot of creative people work without the motivation of money. What is important is to have enough money not to have to think about money.</div>
<div>The super-rich ARE NOT THAT CREATIVE at all. It is a myth, a lie. There are very few Steve Jobs over there. And most of the products are anyway created not by CEO or board members but scientists, engineers, designers that are not paid enormous quantity of money. </div>
<div>Why are gong back to the same trite arguments to support capitalism?</div><div>People could come together, create wonderful things and share them as it is done in many creative commons projects. </div><div>It is just a question of imagining new forms of organization that are not inevitably producing few people that are ruling over everybody else. </div>
<div>Giovanni</div><div><br><div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Nov 12, 2011 at 11:20 AM, Giovanni Santostasi <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:gsantostasi@gmail.com">gsantostasi@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">It is the most stupid form of socialism where money is taken from the poor to subsidize rich individuals and corporations.<div>
Giovanni</div><div><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im">2011/11/12 Kevin G Haskell <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kgh1kgh2@gmail.com" target="_blank">kgh1kgh2@gmail.com</a>></span><br>
</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div></div><div class="h5">My heart goes out to everyone who have lost jobs, houses, gone bankrupt, and have seen a lot of other horrible things happen to them economically. But attacking Capitalism as the problem, when no Western nation presently practices Capitalism, but an awful Socialist/Capitalist hybrid of one sort of the other, is very misguided. <br>
<br>The problem is thousands upon thousands of pages of new regulations placed on people trying to make an independent living, every year, by federal, state,and local governments, are crushing the inventive and productive class. We have to take the burden off from the producers, and out of the hands of the lawyers in government who know nothing other than how to make more laws that oppress those who strive, who want to take care of themselves and their families, not be a burden on the community, not be dependent, and who actually provide jobs and benefits for others. These are the people we should be looking to for leadership, not the people who have put us in this predicament.<br>
<br>But if that majority of people in the OWS movement in Western nations will continue to blame to the wrong parties for this growing mess, then perhaps they should at least stop using the all of the products that were produced by Capitalism, such as their tents, clothes, most foods, cameras, phones, computers, bathrooms, toilet paper, feminine hygiene products, soap, shampoo, ink for their signs, the paper they write their messages on, private and public transportation, etc.,etc. <br>
<br>If the want to really hate Capitalism, let them show it, and have them give up these the products and services, and let them freely roll in the mud in the outdoors (without the benefit of indoor heat and hot water of course, in the winter, to clean up afterwards, or air conditioning when the weather gets sweltering hot, again.) Let them prove it all, and stay outside. They can make their homemade clothes and grow their vegetables. They also should have no ambitions to go to soup kitchens, which are provided by indirect donations derived by Capitalism.<br>
<br>Let those who advocate it here, or anywhere, feel free to either be anti-Capitalist, or support the same sick Socialist/Capitalist mix we've seen that has caused this corrosion and disease we've seen and see. Go ahead to those in here (unnamed, of course,) too, and give up all of those things.<br>
<br>Please do show us the way, through your actions, and not just your words. Go out and live among the OWS and see if they can provide for your needs with their anti-Capitalist ideology. Let them provide for your security (since most of you are defiant about not protecting yourselves with firearms.) Go ahead and trust 'them," whoever they are. If we don't hear from you, we'll assume you found it satisfactory. If we do hear from you, then we'll assume you failed and decided to get real about ending this Progressivism/Socialism disease that's been tearing us all down, and help us fix this situation. <br>
<br>So, go ahead and roll in the mud and your own filth. The rest of us would like to work toward furthering human development and evolution, but we'll keep a close eye on your efforts. We promise.<br><font color="#888888"><br>
Kevin<br>
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