<div>Dang it, I've been deemed sane? That puts a real dent in my reputation. :D </div><div><br></div><div>I'm not saying setting giant ants on slugs wouldn't be fun to try. You provide an interesting perspective on the idea that slugs wouldn't be able to adapt to the ants with a goo layer. However, it doesn't necessarily mean that nature won't find another way around the problem. This sort of predator/prey evolution is something nature is quite good at. :) One possible adaptation, for instance, is that the slugs would simply become bigger over time, making it more difficult for the ants to prey on them. This however might slow the slugs down as well. Without experimentation, however, it'd be really impossible to tell.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Providing nothing really horrifying happened during testing, however, I'd be perfectly happy to risk the chance that the slugs would find a way to evolve out of the situation. As you mentioned, evolution isn't really a problem; we've been using antibiotics for years and they have most assuredly proved useful despite the fact that bacteria are finding ways to resist our solutions. Any solution that can buy us a few decades gives us the chance to come up with a better solution. It's fine if things evolve around our defenses, as long as we can stay a step ahead and have more defenses ready for them afterward.</div>
<div><br></div><div>You would have to test this quite extensively, preferably in a contained environment, before releasing the bugs into many fields, although since you mentioned that the ants die after a few days, I can't imagine they would be able to cause a whole lot of damage. </div>
<div><br></div><div>I do wonder with the whole earthworm issue whether there are species of ants that eat slugs and not earthworms, though. It seems like the researchers' genetic manipulation is widespread to a large variety of ants. Maybe we should write them a letter and ask them what they'd recommend. ;)</div>
<div><br></div><div><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:15px">>>Do feel free to tell us about Kasey. Is it OK for me to mention your highly esteemed ExI-chat relative?</span>
</div><div><br></div><div>Here spike, I'll address both things at the same time and save you the trouble. ;) I'm Kasey Anderson, daughter of Kelly Anderson, who has been hanging around the list for quite a while. :) I'm currently majoring in Biomedical Engineering and planning on getting a PhD in the field eventually as well. I just started a new semester today and am pretty excited as I'll be starting to work with a professor on a research project involving a drug delivery system which has just recently been discovered. (I'll be testing a couple of different drugs that will hopefully help to alleviate some of the problems involved with inflammation that occurs with dialysis).</div>
<div><br></div><div>I'm taking a lot of really fun classes and in addition, I'll be continuing to tutor other college students (something I've been doing since high school, as I took around 60 college credits between 10th-12th grade), which is really a blast. </div>
<div><br></div><div>I have a couple of ideas for what to do with my degree. One of my current goals is to write a science fiction novel. I'm also thinking about the possibility of eventually starting a tissue engineering business. We'll see if either of those things work out. ;) At any rate, getting a degree in BME isn't exactly going to leave me impoverished. :D In the shorter term, I'm trying to do well enough to get into Stanford's PhD program. I finished off my first semester with a 3.9 GPA, so hopefully I can keep my grades up. As for the standardized testing part of getting into grad school, I received a score in the top 5th percentile in the nation on the SAT, so I'm confident I can transfer the testing skills I've learned to the GED.<br>
<br>With the credits I've earned, I'm technically a junior now, but I've basically just finished off my general education and have only taken a few general science courses. I'm 18 and just starting off my education, so try not to mock me too incessantly if I get some aspect of science wrong. (Especially physics. I haven't taken any of that at a college level yet). ;)</div>
<div><br></div><div>-Kasey<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2012/1/8 spike <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:spike66@att.net" target="_blank">spike66@att.net</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> <a href="mailto:extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Kasey Anderson<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, January 08, 2012 11:00 AM<br><b>To:</b> ExI chat list</span></p><div><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [ExI] super soldier ants<u></u><u></u></div><p></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">
<span style="color:#1f497d">>…</span>Well, you know, as long as it's an ant-eat-slug world, sounds like a great idea. ;) But you know, you get the same problem as with the pesticides. At least <i>one</i> of the slugs will survive due to some mutation, and by surviving it will pass its genes on to the next generation of slugs. Super ants? Great. Super slugs? Ewww. :D<u></u><u></u></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Ewwww,? Kasey, why do you ewww? It’s perfect! The real problem isn’t the bugs evolving around the countermeasures. The real problems are the buildup of bad stuff in the topsoil and the cost of applying it. This solves the heck outta both those problems.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Beasts cannot necessarily evolve their way around every countermeasure. This might be a good example of one they couldn’t really evolve around, reasoning: there is a functional cost to having a goo layer on the skin: slugs must absorb oxygen through that. Since that factor would necessarily limit their metabolism, they tend to be slow and methodical about everything. Thus the term sluggish. Or if you are a fan of ancient writings, consider Proverbs 6 verse 6: “Go to the ant, thou sluggard; consider her ways and be wise.”<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Kasey, is that cool or what? We can go to the ant and modify her ways to devour the slug, for which we get the term for a lazy person, the sluggard. Of course, the bible was copied by hand repeatedly and mistakes might have been made. For instance, the proverb might have been written from the point of view of the slug, and it was originally: “Goo to the ant, thou slug guard…” <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">But I digress. Ohhh, this is wicked cool.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">So the slug has a protective goo layer, which limits his ability to absorb oxygen and necessarily limits his metabolism, but the ant does not, so she runs around and works like an ant, while the slug just leaves a revolting slime trail and moves about in a sluggish manner, while writing proverbs. I theorize that the slug cannot evolve a slime layer thick enough to outreach the super ant’s powerful mandibles, for that layer thickness is limited by the necessity to pass oxygen in and carbon dioxide out.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Regarding my alternatives, I do know that copper can build up in topsoil if you don’t have the right kinds of crops to draw it back out of there (we don’t) and it is expensive. So if I can fight slugs with ants, that would please me greatly. If I can avoid the cost of hiring more guys to spread anti-slug pesticides, that would please me even more, and the salmon people would be pleased as well. If I can displace or chase off the other beasts along with the slugs, that is better still.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Note to Kasey: you seem sane and smart, so I switched off your moderation flag. Post freely, me lass, and welcome! Do feel free to tell us about Kasey. Is it OK for me to mention your highly esteemed ExI-chat relative? <span><font color="#888888"><u></u><u></u></font></span></span></p>
<span><font color="#888888"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">spike<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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