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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org [mailto:extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Anders Sandberg<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 15, 2013 11:44 PM<br><b>To:</b> extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [ExI] bees again<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 16/04/2013 06:55, spike wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>>>…</span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>I had an idea related to my earlier urging you to not buy honey this year: do buy almonds. They will cost a lot this year, but my idea is this: if we go ahead and buy overpriced almonds, then the almond growers will be more able to borrow capital with their almond groves as surety for the loans. If so, they can use the borrowed money to invest in stationary hives. Then the almond growers would be less likely to extract honey, which would reduce risk from neonics in the honey-replacement syrup.</span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"'><br></span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>>…</span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"'>Ah, now we have a chance to get into a good, old-fashioned libertarian rage! Because this won't work, because of... government central planned economics.<br><br></span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>>…</span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"'>I kid you not. Take a look at<br><a href="http://www.almondboard.com/Handlers/HandlerServices/MarketingOrder/VolumeRegulation/Pages/Default.aspx">http://www.almondboard.com/Handlers/HandlerServices/MarketingOrder/VolumeRegulation/Pages/Default.aspx</a><br>The Almond Board is controlling the almond production as per a federal marketing order. They literally take a sizeable chunk of the production from growers, decide what the optimum price should be to have an "orderly" market, and sell it to that price</span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>…</span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p><pre>-- <o:p></o:p></pre><pre><span style='color:#1F497D'>>…</span>Anders Sandberg,<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Ja Anders you may be right under ordinary circumstances, but with a sufficiently low supply of almonds, all bets are off. I think most of what you cite above are supports to prevent the price of almonds from dropping too low. But clearly the government cannot stop the price from going arbitrarily high, if the demand is there and the supply sufficiently low. There is no legal structure to prevent a farmer from selling their products for whatever the market will bear.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The almond growers have a kind of a loose confederation, a co-op of sorts, where they have even made commercials together, urging the proles to devour almonds. Their catch phrase: “A can a week, that’s all we ask.” They made some funny advertisements, almond growers buried up to his neck in almonds, uttering the catch phrase.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>But if there are massive almond crop failures, then the price goes crazy and the co-op breaks down, for anyone who manages to make almonds will toss their compatriots to the wind and go for maximum profit.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>If you decide to do your own consumer-level political activism, here’s an idea for you: since almonds will keep for a long time, just go ahead and buy a bunch of them now, while the price is low. That way the shelves get emptied sooner, so that the coming skyrocketing price will happen sooner because of limited supply. Then a year from now or more, when regular almond devourers are missing their favorite snack, you bring out your horded supply and appear generous indeed. Give them away next year as Newtonmas gifts, and perhaps the year after that. I think almonds have a couple years shelf life, longer if unopened. Wrap them with a note inside “Bee kind, don’t buy honey” or something to that effect.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>There is a transhumanist angle to all this, which I will share later, gotta run.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>spike<o:p></o:p></span></pre></div></body></html>