<div dir="ltr"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 1:31 PM, Brent Allsop <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:brent.allsop@gmail.com" target="_blank">brent.allsop@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><br>There are huge benefits to anyone who puts money into circulation. That's why companies create stock, so they can pay for things like employees, other companies, in the stock they create. And it's even more so, for a government. Companies can't print more stock, because they want their stock value to go up (i.e. stock deflation), while a Government wants their currency to inflate some each year, so they must put lots of new money into circulation to keep it from deflating in value. And if your government supplies the exchange currency for the rest of the world, that benefit is HUGE! Every time some libyan hides a US $100 under a mattress, the US must print up another $100, and do something like buy a bomber, or something, with it to keep the value of that $100 from going up to much. The U.S. government provides way more services, than they collect in taxes because of this. The Federal Reserve pays for government expenses, not the other way around.<br>
<br>The question for society is, what should the money that is put into circulation, at a significant rate to keep deflation at bay, do to benefit that society? Most societies figure it is the government's job to figure out what to do with it. Sadly, governments spend way to much of it on war and the ability to destroy all other hierarchies.<br>
<br>A big problem of all Alt currencies to date is all of them are dumb currencies - i.e. they have some fixed dumb algorithmic rate at which they get into society. Currently Bitcoin is producing more than 10% / year. If a country produced that much, they'd have terrible inflation. And the only benefit bitcoin miners add to society is consumption of energy, huge carbon footprint, and so on.<br>
<br>What is needed, is some intelligent system to figure out how to get new currency distributed, to accomplish what the holders of the currency want to do with it (i.e. not more aircraft carriers), in a leaderless, non hierarchically controlled, amplified wisdom of the crowd way. That's the goal of Canonizer.com going cryptographically public with Canon Coins. How many new coins that go into production will be determined by the amplified wisdom of the crowd, and the work done to get that currency into society will be, again, determined by the amplification of the wisdom of the crowd, canoniztion process, or in effect by the will of the holders of the coin. In other words, it will do what the holders of the currency want it to do, not what some hierarchy wants to do with it (i.e. just fear and destroy other hierarchies.)<br>
<br>Obviously, any intelligent currency will always out compete and blow away any dumb currency.<br><br></div>great topic, by the way, thanks for all the great responses so far, everyone.<br><div><br><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra">
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div><div class="h5">On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 4:28 AM, Anders Sandberg <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:anders@aleph.se" target="_blank">anders@aleph.se</a>></span> wrote:<br></div></div>
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<div><div><span><span title="tara@taramayastales.com">Tara Maya</span><span> <<a href="mailto:tara@taramayastales.com" target="_blank">tara@taramayastales.com</a>></span></span> , 9/6/2014 11:25 PM:<div><br>
<blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:2px blue solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div><div>I'm aware of the libertarian roots of Bitcoin and other digital currencies, which some individuals hope (and some states fear) can become true currencies not printed and controlled by a state. I wonder if why it is that states do monopolize currencies (or try to) and what the dangers would be if states simply stopped doing this. Any thoughts?</div>
<div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Coming from a libertarian/Nozickian minarchist angle, it seems that the only legitimate job of the state is protecting the rights and freedoms of the citizens. Usually that is seen as violence monopoly, but it might extend to protection from epidemics too (protection from wild animals too small to see!) However, obviously there are plenty of other functions that are nice to have, it is just that it is not clear the state (the violence monopoly) should be the one running them. </div>
<div><br></div><div>Money has not always been a state monopoly - corporate scrip was widespread, and occasionally I come across Scottish banknotes that are indeed marked with the bank that printed them (valid tender even down here in South England). There might be reasons to want to centralize these functions: I don't know enough economics to argue about it. But even if one wants to centralize money it is not clear that the money monopoly has to be the violence monopoly. In fact, to balance power it might be very reasonable to keep them apart!</div>
<div><br></div><div>Charles Stross had a character make the point (in Glasshouse) that the legitimate role of the state is violence monopoly, timekeeping and identity management. Timekeeping matters since the sequencing of events is paramount for many functions, including the crypto that may underlie money and identity. Identity is not just important for being able to make contracts (the foundation for much minarchist/anarchocapitalist society) but also for effective law enforcement (if it is not possible to tell who did what, at best crude deterrence and heavy locks are the solution). Some of the cryptocurrencies might also take on interesting identity properties; it would be fun to consider if one could put identity management into not just bitcoin wallets but into proof-of-work. </div>
<div><br></div><div>(Or, as I suggested a few months ago, run uploaded minds *on* the money infrastructure)</div><br><br>Anders Sandberg, Future of Humanity Institute Philosophy Faculty of Oxford University</div><br></div>
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