<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000"><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:19.2px;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial">I'm not sure what you think is wrong or how free will is involved, but there's abundant, obvious evidence that children learn and believe "ridiculous religious crap" from their parents.</div><span class="gmail-HOEnZb" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:19.2px;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font color="#888888"><div><br></div><div>-Dave</div></font></span>That's true.  But I am far from convinced that it never changes, as John would have it.  John seems to think that children implant ideas and they are adamant against change.  I strongly disagree.  Let me see some data on how far-out ideas don't change.  Or any ideas that escape changes with the passing years.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000">Ideas are like memories.  They are memories.  When we pull out a memory we change it to a certain extent before putting it back.  So memories change, distort over the years as a result of simply remembering them.  If you have not experienced conflict between you and other people re old memories, then I would think you have not been to a high school reunion.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000">I did not get a Ph. D. in social psychology and persuasive communications (attitude change) for nothing.  But I do not think you will want to have me give you the full lecture on this topic.  Many, many pages.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000">To John - all I meant by free will was that a person could examine his beliefs in light of the evidence of his experiences and his reading and other sources of information, and change them.  He is not stuck with any implanted ideas that occurred earlier in his life.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000">bill w</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000"><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Mar 3, 2018 at 9:57 AM, Dave Sill <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:sparge@gmail.com" target="_blank">sparge@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Mar 3, 2018 at 10:32 AM, William Flynn Wallace <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:foozler83@gmail.com" target="_blank">foozler83@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><span><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline">John Clark wrote:</span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(34,34,34)"> </span></div></span></div></blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><span class=""><span><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline">>By the teen years they no longer take it for granted that what adults tell them is true, but by then its too late, the damage has been done and they will believe ridiculous religious crap for the rest of their life without question. And they will teach the exact same bullshit to their children. </span><br></div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline"><br></span></div></span></span><span class=""><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline">I think this is seriously mistaken - no , just flat wrong.  However, I am no longer interested enough in this conversation to do the research to prove this very wrong, though if you are, and you get data supporting this extremist view, I will be happy to read it.  Not exactly a proponent of free will, are you?</span></div></span></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I'm not sure what you think is wrong or how free will is involved, but there's abundant, obvious evidence that children learn and believe "ridiculous religious crap" from their parents.</div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><div><br></div><div>-Dave</div></font></span></div></div></div>
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