<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">The problem with not attending college: you can be a plumber or whatever, make good money, get married, have kids, go into debt and so on. Those courses in college you were interested in, well, you can go online and take them free. But will you? I am guessing most will not. They are just too busy. This is also how you will lose many of your friends - you will think of them, but while you are changing the baby. No time.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">College is a time where you are given free time - and lots of it - to think as well as study - to meet people (where are you going to meet people after college if you have not acquired a mate? It's a big problem). You are forced, required, to take some courses you might not like. You will not be doing that if you don't go to college. And like most required courses before college, you really needed them though you didn't know it at the time (like those guys who were trying to apply circle math to right triangles in my previous post). You will encounter tons of stuff people who don't go to college will never hear of. Maybe most of that is wasted on you, but you might find some hobbies, some genre of literature, that you wouldn't have otherwise. And so on. Yes, the debt is a big problem.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">But the people who dropped out of college to work, or get married and have kids, rarely come back, though nearly all of them will say they want to. (But when they do, they are among the best students because now they are more mature and know the value of study and how to do it.)</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">I am still a big advocate of college, with all its defects and cost. Some will go through it and not change a bit. Like the cliche' - you get out of it what you put into it.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">bill w</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Nov 20, 2020 at 11:45 AM John Grigg via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">
<p class="MsoNormal"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal">Spike wrote:<br></p><p class="MsoNormal">"We already do this
in Boy Scouts. We have a network of parent volunteers who counsel the
guys and talk about whatever they want to learn, never one on one, but
anything including stuff outside of scouting, such as time management,
buying a car (my specialty) college advice, that kinda thing. Scouts
are a joy to work with: they are already motivated. It is easy to
motivate those who take the initiative, come to the adult, ask questions
and listen to your answers. I can help save them from plenty of
goofball mistakes, one of the most serious ones being to choose the
wrong first car."</p><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal">I was a scout, and that sounds along the lines of being a merit badge counselor. But actually different, because you talk to them as a group about whatever they want to learn about. I had a scoutmaster in Alaska who was not motivated to really help us, though an affable guy, and we mainly just played basketball. But after I aged out, he was replaced by a former Air Force fighter pilot/commercial airline pilot who owned a small plane large enough to take the entire troop anywhere he wanted! Oh, did I envy those guys! Lol <br></p><p class="MsoNormal"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal">My best friend during my teen years, bought a $500 used car where the floor boards had huge gaping holes in them! But other than that, the vehicle ran like a Swiss clock. Our first weekend running around, it starts to rain, and I am screaming for him to slow down so we don't get hammered by water splashing through the floor boards! Lol Later on, the application of duct tape and polyethylene sheets fixed our dilemma. <br></p><p class="MsoNormal"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal">"Regarding
college choices, oh this is a tricky time for students. Our world is
in a rapid transition time, but it isn’t entirely clear where we are
transitioning to."</p><p class="MsoNormal"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal">I keep hearing people saying to not bother with college unless you want to become a specific type of professional, but such advice doesn't sit well with me. I would say go, but do your best to not go into debt, or at least keep it well under control. And I think joining the military to get the G.I. Bill is a good thing for those who want to serve their country. And of course the major a person chooses, will hugely determine the value of their degree. But not everyone is cut out to get a stem degree. <br></p><p class="MsoNormal"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal">The Mormon Church has what they call the Pathways Program which allows people, including non-members, to attend online college for very little money. The curriculum comes from Brigham Young University-Idaho. I think this is one of the coolest things the church has ever done, and an amazing achievement. You are charged based on where you live. In the U.S. a person pays only nine thousand dollars for a bachelor's degree, while in the Philippines, it is only around two thousand dollars for the same thing! The number of majors is limited, but they recently started offering IT degrees. I am now feeling tempted to go back to school and finish up. <br></p><p class="MsoNormal"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal">And of course a trade such as being a plumber or electrician can be very profitable. And in fact, they get paid for learning, rather than be charged for it, as with college! Lol I have a buddy who knew himself, skipped college, and got a welding certification. After a few years doing factory work welding, he joined the pipefitter's union and graduated from an apprenticeship. The guy now makes solid money, owns a beautiful home, drives a nice truck and has no student debts. Ironically, his various girlfriends over the years have had liberal arts college degrees, lots of debt, and don't own their own homes or drive nice cars.He is so far a confirmed bachelor. <br></p>
</div><div><br></div><div>I had a young friend who got a stem "fusion" degree from ASU. It was something brand new at the time. The curriculum developers there like to be creative and different, so they basically combined an electrical engineering degree with a computer science degree. It was essentially half of each, so that the graduate had one foot in the world of engineering, and another foot in the world of comp sci. Well, when he graduated, the poor guy found that employers were not thrilled with his degree, because they wanted both his feet clearly planted in one or the other of the two subjects he studied! Lol Eventually he did okay, but he went through a long frustrating period of rejection. <br></div><div><br></div><div>On the other hand, while perusing Eventbrite, I came upon a panel where they discussed how certain high tech employers are very concerned that the young stem grads they hire will not know enough about the triad of quantum physics, electrical engineering and computer science, as it relates to the development of quantum computers. Yes, this is a tricky time for even the best and brightest! <br></div><div><br></div><div>John<br></div><div><br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Nov 20, 2020 at 9:41 PM spike jones via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div style="border-color:rgb(225,225,225) currentcolor currentcolor;border-style:solid none none;border-width:1pt medium medium;padding:3pt 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org</a>> <b>On Behalf Of </b>John Grigg via extropy-chat<br><b>…</b><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><blockquote style="border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rgb(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium medium 1pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS"">>…<span style="color:black">I assume a life coach is a generalist, not a specialist like people who give advice on jobs or investments or buying a car. bill w<u></u><u></u></span></span></p></div></div></blockquote><div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt">>…I would say life coaching is actually a good example of a profession being enhanced by technology. It did exist before video calls and social media, but due to these innovations, life coaches can now connect with clients from around the world, and have an easier time growing their careers and making a living….John<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">We already do this in Boy Scouts. We have a network of parent volunteers who counsel the guys and talk about whatever they want to learn, never one on one, but anything including stuff outside of scouting, such as time management, buying a car (my specialty) college advice, that kinda thing. Scouts are a joy to work with: they are already motivated. It is easy to motivate those who take the initiative, come to the adult, ask questions and listen to your answers. I can help save them from plenty of goofball mistakes, one of the most serious ones being to choose the wrong first car.<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">Regarding college choices, oh this is a tricky time for students. Our world is in a rapid transition time, but it isn’t entirely clear where we are transitioning to.<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">spike<u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div></div>_______________________________________________<br>
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