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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap:break-word'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b>From:</b> extropy-chat <extropy-chat-bounces@lists.extropy.org> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Dave Sill via extropy-chat<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 18, 2021 6:53 AM<br><b>To:</b> ExI chat list <extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org><br><b>Cc:</b> Dave Sill <sparge@gmail.com><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [ExI] Immaculate Election<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>On Mon, Jan 18, 2021 at 9:38 AM spike jones via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><br>The main argument against the USA issuing national ID is that Americans have<br>the right to privacy encoded in the constitution, article 4. </span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>How would an ID violate privacy?<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Americans have the right to refuse any form of personal identification. Currently it isn’t used even for in-person voting in California. Many activities do require identification, such as driving, but voting does not. Article 4 of the constitution forbids the government from requiring identification just to exist.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>An alternative would be face recognition technology and other biometric<br>identification. …</span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>>…That would have serious privacy implications.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>How well I understand that. However, we have always had face recognition. Now we have the technology to automate that process. It looks to me like there is no logical way to make use of face rec tech illegal.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Our justice system sacrifices speed for public trust, which is why trials<br>take so long but we trust the outcome.</span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>>…It's often too slow and many of us don't trust the outcomes.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Ja to both, but the trust would be far less if it was fast and they would take the convicted out behind the courthouse to a firing squad that day.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Our election system sacrifices<br>public trust for speed, which is why election results are fast but we<br>distrust the outcome.</span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>>…It's OK to distrust the outcome…<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Ja, distrust is growing steadily.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>>… if there's evidence of a problem…<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>The growing distrust is evidence of a problem. The system lacks transparency.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal> >…Every challenge to the 2020 election was thrown out of court because of the lack of evidence.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>-Dave<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>What we need is evidence that would lead to more public trust. I haven’t seen that evidence, but I have seen plenty of evidence of reduced public trust. The system lacks transparency, which leads to public distrust.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>spike<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></div></div></body></html>