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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap:break-word'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b>From:</b> Brent Allsop <brent.allsop@gmail.com> <br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [ExI] Optical illusion tricks you into seeing different colors<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 10:46 AM spike jones via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>…<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Of all the qualia discussion that has gone on for decades here, none of which I understood, this discussion may have triggered a trace of insight. The same red may create slight differences in chemical responses in the brain which operate on very certainly different neural networks, to create an effect all the brains will agree is called red…spike<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>>…Yay, Spike, You are finally getting it!! this is exactly what we have been attempting to describe.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>It isn't that hard as long as you <a href="https://canonizer.com/videos/consciousness/?chapter=differentiate_reality_knowledge" target="_blank">distinguishing between reality and knowledge of reality</a>.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Hi Brent, <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>I do admire your tenacity pal. You know I think the world of you personally (that dinner at Extro5 was way cool, ja?) However you give me credit for understanding far too soon sir. Your encouragement is perhaps described as being prematurely yayey. I still don’t understand the concept to any depth, and admit that I will not understand it until we find a way to write equations for it. I am an equation guy, not a word guy. In any field of engineering (or any other human endevour) which lacked an equals sign, I was mostly lost and deeply distrustful of any results. I can’t help it: equations never let me down. They tell me the truth. I rely on them. In my freely-acknowledged hardcore objectivist view, any field which has no equations is not sufficiently advanced. IN any subjective area, I don’t pretend to the ability to master it, or even apprentice it. That’s why evolution has given us you.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>>…Subjectively, as Dennett points out, we can "directly apprehend" the qualities of our colored knowledge. But when we objectively observe things, from afar, through our senses, the information is necessarily abstracted away from whatever happens to be … <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Brent I am glad you are here, me lad. We need people who get it on that topic. I am not one of them, but I admire those who are.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>spike<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></body></html>