<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">I don't think that dying of a drug or a gunshot is cruel. Gets it over quickly and that's a kindness. The electric chair is more along the lines of cruelty and even short torture.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">A sore arm is cruel? Really? </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">I am mostly opposed to any of them, but if it had to be done, then a chamber of pure nitrogen is the kindest of all. bill w</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Jan 23, 2022 at 5:23 PM Stathis Papaioannou via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><br></div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, 24 Jan 2022 at 09:00, William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Jail is bad enough, I think the Supreme Court needs to decide that solitary confinement is cruel and unusual punishment. Psychologically it just a terrible thing to do to a person. bill w</div></div></blockquote><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Killing them is also cruel, if not unusual. More cruel than solitary confinement or a botched execution attempt causing a sore arm where the injection leaked out.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)" dir="auto"></div></div></blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Jan 23, 2022 at 1:29 PM Will Steinberg via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Jan 23, 2022, 1:37 PM William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">The only problem I have with the 'tough on crime' attitude is that draconian measures are often used, such as the three and out.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Three felonies of any kind means life in prison. Some third crimes are ridiculous in nature but judges hands are tied in most places. Drug crimes are the worst. Small amounts of something put people away for life and that's just wrong. Crimes against people, and to a much lesser extent, property, should be the focus - not victimless crimes. (please don't tell me that there aren't such - I am aware of the argument)</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">This also costs billions of dollars to taxpayers, millions of whom are committing the little crimes that are putting people in jail for life. </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Does anyone know what is happening in Colorado? Now that pot is legal, what about the people in jail for simply possessing it? Should they be set free?</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Tough on crime can mean swatting flies with hammers. bill w</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Jan 23, 2022 at 12:16 PM spike jones via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div style="border-style:solid none none;border-top-width:1pt;padding:3pt 0in 0in;border-top-color:rgb(225,225,225)"><p class="MsoNormal"><b>…</b>> <b>On Behalf Of </b>William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [ExI] enough time has passed...<u></u><u></u></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS"">>…<span style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black">Tribal fear conditioning: just what did you have in mind here? It is my belief that xenophobia is innate. Perhaps only the directions of the fears are determined by social conditioning. Is that what you meant? bill </span>w<u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS"">Billw, ja you and I agree on this. You are right. It is clear to me that xenophobia is innate, but can be suppressed and controlled, just as we can learn to control negative emotions such as anger and fear. Xenophobia is a negative emotion that societal evolution has placed in human kind (and every other kind for that matter.)<u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS"">Over time, our lives have become safer (by a lot.) The notion of treating everyone as equals has a chance to grow into reality if we can maintain a safe society, where fear is low and trust is high.<u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS"">A society which is soft on crime results in more crime, which results in more fear and distrust, which results in reduced acceptance of those less similar which results in crackdowns on crime. This notion is in harmony with Pinker, Dawkins, Geoffrey Miller and to a large extent even Nicholas Christakis.<u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS"">Billw, I have very little cognitive dissonance on the topic of human nature. It is clear enough to me how we got to be the way we are, and where we are going from here.<u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS"">spike<u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS""><u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u> <u style="font-family:"Comic Sans MS""></u></span></p></div></div></div></div>_______________________________________________<br>
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</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr">Stathis Papaioannou</div>
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