<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">I only asked one thing: define willpower such that it is not a circular concept. Every science demands concepts that can be measured objectively and so far, no one has offered a way to measure willpower that is objective and scientific. That's all. I am not sure what you think I am wrong about. I think I am being more scientific on this issue than any of you. Did you notice that Henry did not respond to my invitation to define the term noncircularly, to invent a word. And he wrote a dissertation on it. ??? What's up with that? Maybe he realized that it WAS circular. </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000000">I simplified hunger starting and stopping for Adrian. Did not attempt to write a book on it. bill w</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Apr 8, 2022 at 1:30 PM Will Steinberg via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto">What an overly simplified view of the brain, as if parts of the brain don't send signals to other parts.<div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Why is it so hard to admit you are wrong? You are wrong. The science is the opposite of what you say. You are not a neuroscientist, are you? An addiction researcher? Is there any reason your intuition and personal single anecdote would possibly be something I would consider true over literal thousands of pieces of vetted scientific research?</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Blows my mind. Not sure how you are usually into science but not for this one thing.</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Apr 7, 2022, 4:12 PM William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Adrian, to get a bit technical about your idea, the problem is one of inhibition. The lateral hypothalamus starts the eating process and the ventral stops it. I very much doubt if overeating is brain damage to the ventral hypothalamus though this is possible (very unlikely, as deep as it is in the brain and as common as over eating is - I think the inhibition is just overridden). In fact you could look at all addictions as problems of lacking inhibition. Or overriding it. Bill w</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 12:01 PM Adrian Tymes via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 9:54 AM William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">I am still waiting for those voluntary behaviors you say are lost. bill w</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Depends on the addiction. In the case of overeating, "not eating" is a behavior that you might call voluntary but is no longer an option when hungry.</div><div><br></div><div>Note that "eating" is far more complex than simply "move hand bearing food to mouth". It also involves obtaining food, possibly cooking food, and so on. So, trying to think of it as a simplistic single action that is performed without conscious intent, will confuse and mislead you because it isn't that. </div></div></div>
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