<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">The professor I did research under at university is a Muslim. He once told me that he was raising one of his sons agnostic. I was really surprised at the time as that seemed to go completely against doctrine. I think people leaning on the edge tend to view religion itself as mostly a man-made construct made up of largely arbitrary rules while at the same time recognizing the fundamental existence of God. The trend seems to be that religion is becoming more individualistic and open to interpretation. In a personalized religion divorced from rigid doctrine it shouldn’t matter much what other people believe.<br class=""><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Nov 10, 2022, at 10:52 AM, William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" class="">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family: "comic sans ms", sans-serif; font-size: large;">Those near the border of skepticism and belief have a hard time when it comes to their children. Let them experience religion first hand in a church? Keep them away? Let them know your doubt? And so on. Tough decisions for the agnostic (though not for the hard bitten atheist). bill w</div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Nov 9, 2022 at 5:42 PM Tara Maya via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" class="">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div style="overflow-wrap: break-word;" class="">I imagine it's a Red Queen's arms race between the persuaders and the skeptics--made more difficult that we each play both roles at different times in our lives.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Tara Maya<br class=""><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Nov 8, 2022, at 8:07 AM, BillK via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank" class="">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class=""><div class=""><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">Heh! :) Western societies live in an environment of hidden</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">persuaders. Billions spent on advertising persuasion, government</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">propaganda, religious cults indoctrinating members, social media</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">influencers, etc. It is so prevalent that we don't even notice it.</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">Like a fish asking, "What is this water that you talk about?".</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">The Chinese have large camps to indoctrinate Uyghurs.</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">None of this would be done if persuasion didn't work.</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none" class=""><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:24px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline" class="">Unfortunately it works far too well.</span></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></div></div>_______________________________________________<br class="">
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