<div dir="ltr">I call these "non-informative" speech acts "social tokens". The content is evaluated as pleasant ("your butt looks nice", "fine and you", "we BBQ'd this weekend") or as not-pleasant (literally anything else). The goal of these "social tokens" is the creation of a casual social bond -- by exchanging a social token, you are showing your willingness to be friendly and helpful with the other person, and this increases their "liking" in relation to you. So if you exchange lots of social tokens, someone will think of you as pleasant, kind, and helpful, even if you don't speak often or haven't done anything particularly helpful or nice for them.<div><br></div><div>I find these kinds of speech acts less disgusting if I think of them that way. For example: I try to respond to every single one of my twitter comments, even if it's only a single emoji or a reaction like "riiiiiiight?" and people see this as extremely thoughtful and fun, and it dramatically increases their liking of me. It's just a (more or less) meaningless social token. Try exchanging them with a new acquaintance and see how much it really works. </div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 2:59 PM William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><span style="font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:small">"Yeah, your bum does look a bit big in that. But I still love you". Come on, what is actually wrong with that? </span><span style="font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:small">Ben </span><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:small"><font face="comic sans ms, sans-serif">Ben, you are not playing the game right. What seems to be a question isn't a question. It's a plea for positive feedback. Women know that many of the compliments they get are false and manipulative, but they want them anyway. Go figure. Ask women about it. See what women on this list write about it. Sometimes you just have to say what people want to hear. If you ask "How are you?", do you expect to be given a detailed list of health problems ? No. Play the game. Say "Just fine and how are you?" Now you can say that these social games are superficial and trite, but people know that. You can't meet a person and immediately talk about religion, politics, or sex. It's just "NOT DONE". <u>PLaying the game shows that you can conform to social expectations even though you might hate them</u>. It took me quite a few years to understand this. bill w</font></span><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 12:34 PM Ben Zaiboc via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
On 12/04/2023 14:22, <a href="mailto:efc@swisscows.email" target="_blank">efc@swisscows.email</a> wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite"><br>
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023, Ben Zaiboc via extropy-chat wrote:
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite" style="color:rgb(0,124,255)">What are you
expected to do? lie all the time? Be a fake person?
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
I have a feeling that this is a list of the type of persons who
are
<br>
attracted to this mailing list maybe?
<br>
<br>
Technical/scientific people who work in areas where things work or
don't
<br>
work.
<br>
<br>
However, I've worked a lot (and am working) in sales and
management, so
<br>
I think this is not a binary question. Depending on the situation,
and
<br>
what you want to get out of the situation, you can phrase your
intent in
<br>
many different ways.
<br>
<br>
If I know that someone in my team doesn't react well to direct
feedback,
<br>
I try to soften the blow. If someone doesn't get nuances, I give
it to
<br>
him straight.
<br>
<br>
I don't see that as me "faking" or hiding who I am. I see that as
me
<br>
trying to communicate as effectively as possible to get my ideas
across.
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite" style="color:rgb(0,124,255)">Each point is
saying 'this, this, this.. on the other hand that that that'. So
what are we meant to understand from this?
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
Not much. I would take with me the message that adapt how you
<br>
communicate depending on the situation and what you would like to
get
<br>
out of it.
<br>
<br>
Best regards, Daniel
</blockquote>
<br>
Thanks, Daniel.<br>
<br>
I do see what you're getting at. For me, this idea of adapting your
message seems to imply that communication is not about communication
as such, rather more about manipulation.<br>
<br>
Personally, I balk at that. I know how to be manipulative (to a
degree, anyway. Can't claim to be an expert!), and I don't like it.
I feel it makes me a worse person, not a better one, so tend to
avoid it. I can't say if Honesty is really the best policy, but it's
certainly the most honest one, and the one that makes me feel good
about myself. Constantly manipulating people would definitely not do
that.<br>
<br>
"Yeah, your bum does look a bit big in that. But I still love you".
Come on, what is actually wrong with that?<br>
<br>
Ben<br>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
extropy-chat mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
extropy-chat mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat</a><br>
</blockquote></div>