<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div>Gadersd, Did you just forget to leave out the "Abstract" machine?</div><div>Yes, we are biological machines, and machines can be phenomenal (if they represent information with redness and grenness), so it is important to think clearly, and use sufficiently grounded terminology.</div><div>For more information see: <a href="https://www.jneurophilosophy.com/index.php/jnp/article/view/54">Physicists Don't Understand Color Qualities</a>.</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Jun 21, 2023 at 8:58 AM Gadersd via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div style="overflow-wrap: break-word;"><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large">If all of this is moving in the direction of giving human rights to <b><font color="#ff0000">(an Abstrct)</font></b> machines, I think it's wrong.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Are you not a biological machine?<br><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Jun 21, 2023, at 10:17 AM, William Flynn Wallace via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:</div><br><div><div dir="ltr"><div style="font-family:"comic sans ms",sans-serif;font-size:large">If all of this is moving in the direction of giving human rights to machines, I think it's wrong. bill w</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Jun 21, 2023 at 8:59 AM Gadersd via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">There is nothing wrong with abusing a zombie but abusing a sentient creature is something generally considered wrong. If there is an animal or machine that acts as if it were conscious and we don’t have a way to distinguish acting from the real thing then we had better treat such entities as if they were conscious.<br>
<br>
> On Jun 21, 2023, at 7:21 AM, BillK via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org" target="_blank">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br>
> <br>
> How could we distinguish conscious AI from its zombie equivalent?<br>
> The idea that consciousness emerges naturally alongside intelligence<br>
> could be an anthropocentric distortion.<br>
> June 20, 2023 Anil Seth<br>
> <br>
> <<a href="https://bigthink.com/the-future/intelligence-conscious-ai/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://bigthink.com/the-future/intelligence-conscious-ai/</a>><br>
> <br>
> Quotes:<br>
> From the 16th-century golem to the replicants in Blade Runner, stories<br>
> of sentient human-like creatures tend to end in philosophical and<br>
> existential chaos.<br>
> The rapid rise of AI has lent fresh urgency to questions about machine<br>
> consciousness.<br>
> It is a mistake to assume that intelligence — at least in advanced<br>
> forms — is either necessary or sufficient for consciousness.<br>
> <br>
> Although intelligence offers a rich menu of ramified conscious states<br>
> for conscious organisms, it is a mistake to assume that intelligence —<br>
> at least in advanced forms — is either necessary or sufficient for<br>
> consciousness. If we persist in assuming that consciousness is<br>
> intrinsically tied to intelligence, we may be too eager to attribute<br>
> consciousness to artificial systems that appear to be intelligent, and<br>
> too quick to deny it to other systems — such as other animals — that<br>
> fail to match up to our questionable human standards of cognitive<br>
> competence.<br>
> --------------<br>
> <br>
> BillK<br>
> <br>
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