<div dir="auto">What do you think about what Tegmark says about theories being all or nothing z that we can't take them piecemeal like we can get coffee without caffeine. (Did you see that part of his argument?)<div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Jason </div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Sep 14, 2023, 6:25 PM efc--- via extropy-chat <<a href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hello Jason and Bill (and by extension, the AI ;)),<br>
<br>
I just wanted to address the Tegmark bit, and I'll get back to your email <br>
(Jason) later since I like to read it, and then sleep on it, to see if <br>
sleeps yields any additional insights.<br>
<br>
But the Tegmark bit, was a quick read (unless some crucial parts are <br>
hidden on the remaining pages):<br>
<br>
> Since the theory posits the existence of an infinite<br>
> number of parallel universes, each with different outcomes, it becomes<br>
> impossible to experimentally verify or disprove this claim.<br>
> <br>
> This is false, see the page I cited from Tegmark's book on falsifiability:<br>
> <a href="https://archive.org/details/ourmathematicalu0000tegm_o1e8/page/124/mode/2up?q=%22Are+theories%22" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://archive.org/details/ourmathematicalu0000tegm_o1e8/page/124/mode/2up?q=%22Are+theories%22</a><br>
<br>
So based on that page, the argument goes that Einsteins theories have<br>
testable components, and they also make predictions about the insides of<br>
a black whole that we cannot test.<br>
<br>
Likewise, qm contains testable components, and yields interpretations of<br>
which one is the MWI.<br>
<br>
Then Tegmarks argues, that since we accept Einsteins theory, we must<br>
accept what it tells us about black holes, and here is where I disagree<br>
with him. Actually, I think its just a matter of degree and<br>
interpretation, so I'm not sure we would disagree at all. But that's<br>
besides the point.<br>
<br>
The reason I disagree with Tegmark is that we cannot (yet) test to<br>
confirm the predictions of what happens inside a black whole. That puts<br>
us in the position of being able to test some claims of Einstein, and<br>
use them profitably. The theory in turn, makes untestable predictions,<br>
theories, ideas, about what happens inside a black hole.<br>
<br>
The key here is that it is a theory, a useful tool, that makes<br>
predictions about this world, and places in this world we cannot access.<br>
That means that we today can never say what actually happens inside a<br>
black hole. We can only estimate, but never verify. Yes, what follows<br>
out of Einstien is for sure better than a fiction book, but at the end<br>
of the day we have to accept that it will most likely forever remain<br>
theory, even though it is an enlightened one.<br>
<br>
That is why I do not accept that MWI is testable. That claim is not<br>
testable, and that also doesn't take into account that MWI is not the<br>
only interpretation, or other possibly future ones.<br>
<br>
So to put this in more dramatic terms, if a theory predicts god, but a<br>
god that will forever be absent, will never respond, and will never<br>
affect your world in any way, for all we know, we can safely just<br>
disregard it. God might be a theoretical possibility or extrapolation,<br>
but at the end of the day its just a nice story and will never be true<br>
knowledge and true certainty.<br>
<br>
The scientific method is a great tool for this world, and so is math,<br>
but it does break down into metaphysics when applied to gods and other<br>
entities which by definition are completely outside the scope of this<br>
world.<br>
<br>
I'll get back to that in the other thread in time, so please bear with<br>
me.<br>
<br>
Best regards, <br>
Daniel<br>
<br>
<br>
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</blockquote></div>