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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 04/10/2025 19:56, John Clark wrote:<br>
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<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Oct 4, 2025 at
6:24 AM Ben Zaiboc via extropy-chat <<a
href="mailto:extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">extropy-chat@lists.extropy.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
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style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><i><font
size="4" face="georgia, serif"><span
class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">> </span>I'm
now wondering if even some western nations might not
enact<br>
legislation to outlaw uploading, once it becomes
possible. It wouldn't<br>
surprise me, there are plenty of people who regard it as
tantamount to<br>
suicide, even among people who regard themselves as
transhumanists or<br>
materialists. It wouldn't be hard for a government to
conclude that it<br>
should be illegal (or that uploads don't count as human,
and don't have<br>
any rights** at all).</font></i></blockquote>
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<div><font size="4" face="tahoma, sans-serif"><b>The thing is<span
class="gmail_default" style="">,</span> you're
assuming that<span class="gmail_default" style=""> when
uploading not only becomes possible but is also
practical and inexpensive enough for wide scale use,
human beings will still be the ones in the driver's
seat, and I don't believe that will be the case. </span></b></font></div>
<div><font size="4" face="tahoma, sans-serif"><b><br>
</b></font></div>
<div><font size="4" face="tahoma, sans-serif"><b><span
class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">John K
Clark</span> </b></font></div>
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<br>
Good point. I hope you're right.<br>
<br>
This also relates to your question about UBI, I think.<br>
The dramatic increase in productivity we're expecting could enable
UBI globally (leaving other considerations like political issues
aside), and if this coincides with mass availability of uploading,
it wouldn't just enable a comfortable upper middle-class lifestyle,
it would enable an unimaginably luxurious lifestyle for everyone who
wanted it (provided they are an upload), and a very comfortable
lifestyle for all biological humans. <i>Provided the income from
the increased productivity was distributed fairly to everyone.</i>
Whether that's likely, and under what circumstances, is a different
matter. Again, I reckon human beings being displaced from the
driver's seat would be a minimum prerequisite.<br>
<br>
All of this speculation suffers from the same problem as almost all
fiction: Looking at a single application of whatever marvellous
technology is being talked about, and not considering synergistic
effects. Basically, we're speculating about what lies beyond the
singularity, which we know is pretty pointless, except maybe as a
mental preparation for massive change (which will still surprise all
of us, one way or another). It is important, though, to know what
you want, just in case there's any chance of being able to choose.<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Ben</pre>
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