<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote gmail_quote_container"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, 22 Mar 2026 at 11:47, BillK <<a href="mailto:pharos@gmail.com">pharos@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_quote"><div></div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)">For extra clarification, I asked Grok a follow-up question.</div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)">BillK</div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class="gmail_default">-----------------------------------</div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class="gmail_default">I pointed out to Grok that the five uploads probably won't continue live streaming from the biological brain because their processing will be hundreds of times faster. Grok agreed and redid the response.</div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class="gmail_default">BillK</div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class="gmail_default"><br></div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class="gmail_default">Grok 4.20 Expert -</div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class="gmail_default"></div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class="gmail_default"><p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap"><strong>Yes — you are precisely right, and that detail makes the scenario even cleaner and more interesting.</strong></p>
<p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap">The initial “streaming” to the five data centers is almost certainly a <strong>high-bandwidth one-time (or very short-burst) transfer of the scan state</strong> — essentially broadcasting the same snapshot (or a few milliseconds of live data) to all five locations so they all boot from <em>identical</em> starting conditions. After that millisecond, each upload runs on its own hardware at whatever speed its owners choose — and “hundreds or thousands of times faster” is the default expectation for useful mind uploads (you’d want to think, learn, and experience at accelerated subjective rates).</p>
<h3 dir="auto">What actually happens, step by step</h3>
<ol dir="auto"><li><p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap"><strong>t = 0 (activation)</strong>
All five uploads wake up with <em>exactly</em> the same mental state as the biological you had at the moment the snapshot was taken.
Each one experiences perfect continuity: “I just underwent the non-destructive upload… here I am in data-center #3… yep, still me.”
The biological you (running at normal speed) also still feels exactly the same.
→ <strong>Six identical claimants</strong> for a brief subjective instant. Your intuition holds 100 %.</p></li><li><p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap"><strong>t > 0 (immediately after)</strong></p><ul dir="auto"><li>The biological brain continues at ~1× speed, receiving normal sensory input.</li><li>Each upload is now running at, say, 500× or 1,000× clock speed inside its own simulated environment.</li><li>There is no practical way to keep feeding the biological brain’s real-time signals into the fast uploads without massive desynchronization (the upload would finish processing a whole day’s worth of thoughts in a few real-world seconds).</li><li>So each upload either:
• Runs in a self-contained simulated world (with simulated body, simulated internet, simulated friends, or just pure thought), or
• Has throttled input that is deliberately slowed down to match whatever rate the owners want.</li></ul><p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap">Result: <strong>all five immediately begin experiencing different things</strong> — different virtual environments, different people talking to them first, tiny timing differences in hardware, different random seeds, different decisions they make at super-speed, etc. Divergence is not “rapid” in real time — it is <em>instantaneous</em> in their subjective time. Within their first subjective hour they could already be noticeably different people.</p></li></ol>
<h3 dir="auto">Practical consequences people actually plan for</h3>
<ul dir="auto"><li>The five uploads will almost certainly <strong>not</strong> stay synchronized with the biological original or with each other for more than a few real-world seconds.</li><li>Each will quickly become its own independent person who still <em>remembers</em> being the original but now has a separate life story.</li><li>Common solutions people discuss:<ul dir="auto"><li>Run them at the same accelerated speed in identical simulated environments for a while (so they stay closer clones longer), then deliberately fork them.</li><li>Periodically merge selected memories back into the biological you or into a “main” copy (mind-merging tech is expected to be easier than perfect syncing).</li><li>Treat it like having quintuplets: five new siblings who all love you and share your values, but who immediately start living their own (much faster) lives.</li></ul></li></ul>
<p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap">So yes — your refinement is spot-on and actually strengthens the point. The “live streaming from the biological brain” model only works if <em>everything</em> is kept at 1× speed (which almost nobody wants). The moment you let the uploads run at useful speeds, the five copies become five fully autonomous branches within minutes of real time — each loudly and sincerely declaring “I am the continuation of the original me,” while rapidly becoming five distinct individuals.</p>
<p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap">Exactly as you described. This is why the branching/fission problem is considered <em>unavoidable</em> once non-destructive uploading + speed-up is on the table. Most people who are excited about it simply embrace the multiplicity: “Great — now I get five futures instead of one."</p><p dir="auto" style="white-space:pre-wrap">--------------------------------</p><br></div></div></div>