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Steve's point is a good one, but doesn't probe deeply enough. Actually,
I don't see conservatives accusing the left of lying. They accuse them
of being thougthless and irrational, denying their own thoughtless and
irrational sides, as Steve points out. As I mentioned, David Horowitz
clearly documents the use of lies by the left to achieve its aims,
although he was too honest to remain in the radical left. So the left
says "Lies" and the right says "Emotional idiots, ignorant of history."<br>
<br>
RE: Bush lying. It is difficult for me to defend Bush since I don't
like him at all, but I do not think he has lied. I admit to a dislike
of Kerry that is probably over the top, but it is clear to me that he
has consistently lied from day one. He lied about his war record, he
lied saying we (most soldiers) had committed atrocities, and today he
lies about the draft, social security, Iraq, and about Bush lying. Most
humorous of all, he lied about his goose hunt! (He said, 'We all got
geese' but there were only three geese for four men.What a weird guy.)
I am disgusted that the Democrats have no one to run behind better
than this man.<br>
<br>
So each side does accuse the other. Of the Right, only Ann Coulter
seems to enjoy her own projections, and thus is not their slave. When
she writes, it is with a wink and a grin, as if to say, "We're all just
having fun here." <br>
Lynn<br>
<br>
<br>
Steve Hovland wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid01C4BF6C.D501BA90.shovland@mindspring.com">
<pre wrap="">I suspect that both sides are guilty of projection.
You cannot assert that Kerry lies without recognizing
that Bush does too. Assuming that both candidates
embody the true state of the electorate to some degree,
it doesn't say much for us when the truth becomes
a liability.
Bush clearly demonstrated black and white thinking
when he said that on the matter of Iraq other countries
were either with us or they were the enemy. His
father demonstrated much more sophistication in
building his coalition for the first war.
Bush's advisors also do the same thing when they say we
had no choice other than invading Iraq or letting Saddam
run amuck. Saddam was in fact imprisoned in Baghdad,
with 2/3 of Iraq's territory a no-fly zone and the most of
the remainder under the control of an army he feared.
There were many options that were not exercised.
You also see this on the conservative talk shows. If
someone from the left suggests that the benefit of
getting rid of Saddam depends upon how much it costs,
the conservative will assert that the cost doesn't matter,
only the principle.
Steve Hovland
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.stevehovland.net">www.stevehovland.net</a>
-----Original Message-----
From: Lynn D. Johnson, Ph.D. [<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:SMTP:ljohnson@solution-consulting.com">SMTP:ljohnson@solution-consulting.com</a>]
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 2:38 PM
To: The new improved paleopsych list
Subject: Re: [Paleopsych] demons
These comments betray a misunderstanding of the subjects.
Fundamentalists - what ever that means - appear to be the demonic side
of liberals. Onto them - and onto 'conservatives' - are projected
unacceptable aspects of the self. So liberals accuse conservatives of
all their own sins, and the conservatives become the scapegoats, onto
which the community sins are placed. (E. g., Kerry, a profligate liar,
accuses Bush of lying.)
In his book, _Radical Son_, David Horowitz recounts being amazed at the
acceptance that conservatives had for his own failings (the failed
marriages, for example), whereas his former radical colleagues showed
all the hate and rejection that Horowitz had always projected onto the
Right. He says he realized that the rules that conservatives propose are
not there so that no one will break them. They are there because they
_will_ be broken, but having the rules reduces the likelihood that
people will break them, and, says Horowitz, because life works better
when you obey them.
I found that Radical Son explained the paradox I had often puzzled at.
My conservative friends are the most accepting/tolerant of contrasting
opinions, whereas my liberal friends are the most rigid and rejecting of
opinions that contrast their own. What is it about the Left that makes
them so hateful?
Lynn Johnson
Steve Hovland wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Sounds like conservatives :-)
Steve Hovland
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.stevehovland.net">www.stevehovland.net</a>
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Christopher [<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:SMTP:anonymous_animus@yahoo.com">SMTP:anonymous_animus@yahoo.com</a>]
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 11:11 AM
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:paleopsych@paleopsych.org">paleopsych@paleopsych.org</a>
Subject: [Paleopsych] demons
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Borderline personality disorder is a disorder
</pre>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">characterized by an overuse of a defense mechanism
called 'splitting.' In splitting, a person is unable
to hold or reconcile two opposing ideas in their mind
at the same time, so they use black-and-white thinking
to protect themselves from contradictory
feelings, gray areas and ambiguities.<<
--Sounds like fundamentalism. Are demons split-off
aspects of the self that the self cannot integrate and
cannot ignore?
Michael
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