<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2900.2604" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY id=role_body style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"
bottomMargin=7 bgColor=#ffffff leftMargin=7 topMargin=7 rightMargin=7>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>I have taken the liberty of posting
below both of Howard's replies to Joe Quirk's commentary:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>
<BLOCKQUOTE>"Once you win, you've got a reputation to live up to, even if you
weren't so inclined, you get surrounded by an entourage that's also heavily
invested in your reputation," said Redelmeier. "So you end up sleeping
properly every night, eating well, exercising regularly every
day."<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>In the first is presented a scenario in
which 90% of kids who grow up with single, abusive, drug or drink-addled mothers
end up unsuccessful yet the remaining 10% are able to attain success due to
their bonding with suitable mentors. </FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3>Howard then offers some examples including one twin attaining BigMan
status in womb while the other is relegated to the closet with his title: Loser
in Womb Wars. I doubt if these studies by an Italian researcher have
followed the nurturing process throughout adolescence and into middle age.
Nature allowed, possibly by chance, prime real estate for one twin but whether
that twin is able to maintain the family farm is another question.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>In his second reply Howard has offered
all of us the fear of success scenario whereby someone who attains
early acolades "would make some folks edgy as hell--and nearly suicidal if
they couldn't live up to their previous achievements and seemed to be slipping
badly." </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>Take your pick....but I'll guess that
receiving an Oscar for best director at a ripe old age of 75 was an honor much
appreciated by Clint Eastwood. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>Gerry Reinhart-Waller</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3></FONT>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3>*****************************************************</FONT></DIV><A
href="http://www.home.earthlink.net/~waluk"></A></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title=HowlBloom@aol.com href="mailto:HowlBloom@aol.com">HowlBloom@aol.com</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=joe@quirk.net
href="mailto:joe@quirk.net">joe@quirk.net</A> ; <A title=emdls@pacbell.net
href="mailto:emdls@pacbell.net">emdls@pacbell.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 05, 2005 10:17 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: Tortured Souls & Eunuchs at
Orgies...</DIV></DIV></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid"><FONT
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>
<BLOCKQUOTE>"Once you win, you've got a reputation to live up to, even if
you weren't so inclined, you get surrounded by an entourage that's also
heavily invested in your reputation," said Redelmeier. "So you end up
sleeping properly every night, eating well, exercising regularly every
day."<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV></DIV>Your points are good ones, Joe. It's like the problem of
resilient kids. Roughly one out of ten kids who grow up with single,
abusive, drug or drink-addled mothers end up as very successful adults.
What do these kids have in common? The find mentors, substitute parents to
whom they bond.
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>This leaves us with a puzzle. Do these kids become more successful
because they have an attachment to a significat other, an emotionally
meaningful, nurturing other, something most tormented kids like this lack?
Or do these resilient kids have an attachment to a mentor because the are born
with better social instincts, the instincts of self-confidence and extroversion
that make them bold enough to find others they can attach themselves to?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Which came first, the confidence or the social connection? Is the
success these kids have later in life due to their outgoing nature or due to the
mentors that outgoing nature brings? Or are the two--confidence and social
connection--inseparable?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Is there a gene-tweak or a womb-experience that makes for more confident
kids and others who are born with shyness and overwhelming
insecurities? In twin studies by an Italian researcher, regular
sonographic scans of the two kids in the womb showed that there was a battle
taking place in utero. One twin managed to take over the living room of
the womb--the central chamber, The other kid was shoved aside and had to
gestate in a corner, in a sort-of closet of the womb.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>When the two finally made it from the uterus into the outside word, the
winner of the womb war was outgoing and self-confident. When a stranger
showed up, the winner ran over clearly expecting to win the stranger over.
It saw this new social contact as an opportunity.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>The loser in the womb wars saw the same stranger and hugged its mother's
legs in panic, then ran off to something eerily like its old uterine closet--it
hid in a side room. ThIs kid saw a stranger as a danger, not as a new
opening.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Did the winner of the womb wars win by chance and then gain the benefits of
his land grab for intra-uterine space? Or was there some gene-tweak
that predestined him to win?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Does womb-real estate change the nature of the kid--does it change
the way that genes express themselves? Or does some small gene-fluke
exist even in what we think of as genetically identical kids?
Howard</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT lang=0 face=Arial size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"
PTSIZE="10">----------<BR>Howard Bloom<BR>Author of The Lucifer Principle: A
Scientific Expedition Into the Forces of History and Global Brain: The Evolution
of Mass Mind From The Big Bang to the 21st Century<BR>Visiting Scholar-Graduate
Psychology Department, New York University; Core Faculty Member, The Graduate
Institute<BR>www.howardbloom.net<BR>www.bigbangtango.net<BR>Founder:
International Paleopsychology Project; founding board member: Epic of Evolution
Society; founding board member, The Darwin Project; founder: The Big Bang Tango
Media Lab; member: New York Academy of Sciences, American Association for the
Advancement of Science, American Psychological Society, Academy of Political
Science, Human Behavior and Evolution Society, International Society for Human
Ethology; advisory board member: Youthactivism.org; executive editor -- New
Paradigm book series.<BR>For information on The International Paleopsychology
Project, see: www.paleopsych.org<BR>for two chapters from <BR>The Lucifer
Principle: A Scientific Expedition Into the Forces of History, see
www.howardbloom.net/lucifer<BR>For information on Global Brain: The Evolution of
Mass Mind from the Big Bang to the 21st Century, see
www.howardbloom.net<BR></FONT></DIV></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3>*****************************************************</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title=HowlBloom@aol.com href="mailto:HowlBloom@aol.com">HowlBloom@aol.com</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=joe@quirk.net
href="mailto:joe@quirk.net">joe@quirk.net</A> ; <A title=emdls@pacbell.net
href="mailto:emdls@pacbell.net">emdls@pacbell.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Cc:</B> <A title=paleopsych@paleopsych.org
href="mailto:paleopsych@paleopsych.org">paleopsych@paleopsych.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 05, 2005 10:30 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> [Paleopsych] Re: Tortured Souls & Eunuchs at
Orgies...yet more</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT id=role_document face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 3/3/2005 8:08:49 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, <A
href="mailto:joe@quirk.net">joe@quirk.net</A> writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid"><FONT
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>"Once
you win, you've got a reputation to live up to, even if you weren't so
inclined, you get surrounded by an entourage that's also heavily invested in
your reputation," said Redelmeier. "So you end up sleeping properly every
night, eating well, exercising regularly every day</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV>This statement, as you've pointed out, Joe, is riddled with not-so-hidden
assumptions. Getting a reputation to live up to would make some folks edgy
as hell--and nearly suicidal if they couldn't live up to their previous
achievements and seemed to be slipping badly. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Some folks feel utterly isolated and unwanted even when they're surrounded
by an entourage. Some wonder if the entourage is simply there for the
glory of association with a big name or is really there for THEM, for the inner
human stripped of his or her fame and accomplishments.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>And some folks feel utterly bereft when the reach a pinnacle. They
feel they have nothing new to strive for, and the goal-lessness leaves them
drowning in the acid of depression.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I've seen all these things happen to the stars I've worked with.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Which means that how you take winning an Oscar is a matter of
perception. Some folks can see new horizons beckoning from even the worst
of things. Others can see new hells in even the greatest glories.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>My guess, a hypothesis to consider, is that those who see the best in
what's around them, those who see opportunities even in catastrophe, are most
likely to attract the kind of popularity among Academy of Motion Picture Arts
and Sciences members that makes an Oscar possible.
Howard</DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT lang=0 face=Arial size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"
PTSIZE="10">----------<BR>Howard Bloom<BR>Author of The Lucifer Principle: A
Scientific Expedition Into the Forces of History and Global Brain: The Evolution
of Mass Mind From The Big Bang to the 21st Century<BR>Visiting Scholar-Graduate
Psychology Department, New York University; Core Faculty Member, The Graduate
Institute<BR>www.howardbloom.net<BR>www.bigbangtango.net<BR>Founder:
International Paleopsychology Project; founding board member: Epic of Evolution
Society; founding board member, The Darwin Project; founder: The Big Bang Tango
Media Lab; member: New York Academy of Sciences, American Association for the
Advancement of Science, American Psychological Society, Academy of Political
Science, Human Behavior and Evolution Society, International Society for Human
Ethology; advisory board member: Youthactivism.org; executive editor -- New
Paradigm book series.<BR>For information on The International Paleopsychology
Project, see: www.paleopsych.org<BR>for two chapters from <BR>The Lucifer
Principle: A Scientific Expedition Into the Forces of History, see
www.howardbloom.net/lucifer<BR>For information on Global Brain: The Evolution of
Mass Mind from the Big Bang to the 21st Century, see
www.howardbloom.net<BR></FONT></DIV></FONT>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>paleopsych mailing
list<BR>paleopsych@paleopsych.org<BR>http://lists.paleopsych.org/mailman/listinfo/paleopsych<BR></BODY></HTML>