[extropy-chat] Extropy and libertarianism

Giu1i0 Pri5c0 pgptag at gmail.com
Thu Sep 8 10:58:20 UTC 2005


Thanks Hal for this very good post which, I am sure, will be discussed a lot.
I am one of those who "would view such a society, without the economic
protections which have become nearly ubiquitous in the modern world,
as barbaric, primitive and unfair."
Why?
First let me say that I am very keen of libertarianism as a lifestyle,
and believe in live and let live: my sexual preferences are not your
business, and your religious preferences are not my business. I think
interfering in someone's private sphere should be tolerated, if at
all, only in exceptional cases. The problem, of course, is that at
times what you wish to consider as part of your private sphere can
have an objective impact on my private sphere. Then I also become a
stakeholder. Short of shooting each other and the winner takes all, we
then need to find a mutually agreeable solution.
I think the heart of the issue is, as you quote: "In open societies
people seek neither to rule nor to be ruled. Individuals should be in
charge of their own lives."
But the unfortunate thing is that, some people DO seek to rule others
and to impose their views and ways on others. This is a fact. Someone
who tries to rule me is also trying to prevent me from being in charge
of my own life, so I will oppose him.
In our world power is something that you buy with money. The more
money you have, the more power you can buy.
I have no lust power and no lust for more money than I can use. So I
do not really envy those who have much more money than I - they are
welcome to live their lives, as long as they let me live mine. But
suppose all those with power (= money) decide to pool their power (=
money) to control my life. Then I cannot live my life without
accepting their rule. Please don't tell me that this is consistent
with Extropy.
Money and power can easily go into runaway mode: the more you have,
the more you get. The result of this runaway process can be a world
where a few feudal warlords have absolute power over the lives of
"their" people. We may not like living under their rule, but they have
all the money, all the power and all the guns. Is this consistent with
Extropy? No.
The only solution that I can see is fine-tuning the system to permit
people living their life as they want to live it, while at the same
time preventing power runaway. In other words, I want to live in a
system where you are in complete control of your life, but *cannot*
achieve control of mine.
We have not found yet the ideal mechanism to achieve this objective,
but it is difficult for me to imagine one which works without
involving some kind of welfare state concept, some kind of safety nets
and some kind of taxation.
G.



On 9/8/05, "Hal Finney" <hal at finney.org> wrote:
> I know this is a controversial topic, and this may be an unwelcome
> contribution, but I suggest that it is reasonable and appropriate
> to look at the Principles of Extropy and consider what they say about
> various political systems.  My reading of the principles of Open Society
> and Self-Direction is that they point very much towards a libertarian
> approach to political life.



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