[extropy-chat] Putting God to Rest

[Anna Taylor]

--- Samantha Atkins <sjatkins at mac.com> wrote:

>Actually everyone has a right to believe whatever
>they wish but they have no right whatsoever to
>respect or kind treatment for believing pernicious
>nonsense.  The nonsense itself has no "rights" at
>all. There is no "debate" implied or required here.

There is no debate for you.  Are you implying that any
and all people that believe in God should have no
right to respect?  

>What, by debating how many angels can dance on a
>nanobot?   How does that help anyone?  

I choose to respect her beliefs and in that I try to
incorporate ideas to integrate within her reality. 
Are you saying the best approach is to simply tell her
she's a complete idiot for believing in Religion?  How
does that help anyone?

>What business do you have speaking about God and what
>God might object to?  

I have taken the time to learn theology so I feel I
have every business discusing God with my mother.

>You know you are talking nonsense yet you
>condescendingly talk religious baby talk to them to
>try to get your point across to those who believe. 
>This is dishonest and perhaps cowardly.  Are you
>ashamed to be an atheist?

There are many things I respect about Religion
therefore I don't believe it's nonsense.  If taking 
the time to understand someone else's point of view 
is dishonest and cowardly, then yes I am.  I don't
understand how a post about common courtesy for other
people's beliefs has anything to do with me being
ashamed to be an atheist.

> You don't?  Then why aren't you a believer?

Who cares whether I am a believer or not?  I thought
this list was about Transhumanism, future technology,
prolonging life etc., if it is,  whether the majority 
is Atheist has no relevancy to the fact that the
minority have every right to be respected. If the
Extropy list is set on defining that "to be Extropian
one must be atheist" then fine but until that is
clearly stated everybody on this list deserves the
right to be respected.  When you denounce Religion,
you are not respecting their beliefs.

> You may do something worse than not try.  You seem
> to sort of pretend to take her side. 

What if I grew up in Religion and decided it wasn't
for me?  Does that mean I am pretending to take her
side?  What if I understand her point of view, just
simply don't agree?.  I may not change her mind about
God but bringing up ideas such as Cryonics from her
point of view is a creative way at getting my point
accross, that to me seems more logical than calling
her beliefs "bullshit".

>If God exists and is as the majority of Christians
>believe then I would most certainly be on the "other
>side".  Such a Being would be monstrously evil.   

I would like for you to explain to me what are the
common beliefs about God that the majority of
Christians have.  "Such a Being would be Monstrously
evil" is the reason why I brought up the point to
begin with.

>Do you see what is wrong with telling many of us
>here that we must "respect their beliefs" in a
>similar fashion to what you choose to do or we aren't
>reasonable people?   Thank you for your opinion but
>it is certainly not binding on me.

I am not saying that you have to respect their
beliefs, I am saying you should respect the people on
this list that may be religious.

>Then I do not believe you are through learning about
>religion.  If you knew it better you would have a
>problem with it.

Why should I have a problem with it?  Explain to me
why religion as a whole is that bad.  I am aware why I
don't believe but I would like to hear your rational
point of views.

>What for?  What is it about a group of people who
>are more shut of religion saying what they think of
>it that bothers you so much?  

I loathe disrespect. This list is not about Religion
therefore out of respect for those that are religious,
comments and statements that ridicule their beliefs
should not be made.  What is wrong with that?

>You grant religious folks room to believe and
>practice all manner of zany and even dangerous things
>and respect them doing so and don't go out your way
>to challenge them.  Yet a few things set by atheists
>here and you feel utter frustration and get upset? 
>Why? I think you may need to examine what is going on
>in you more deeply.

I think it's the other way around.  Your blatant hate
does nothing to change the minds of those that are
religious so why state the opinion in the first place?
 Have you ever thought that I consider many on this
list as being rational and logical and in that
respect, I choose to defend the ones that are being
subjected to ridicule and contempt?  I'm sorry you
don't understand that.  

Obviously my point wasn't well received, I apologize
for that.  It wasn't my intention to start a battle
between the religious and the atheists, I was just
trying to give the same respect to those that are
Atheists as to those that aren't.  You can guarantee I
will never bring up Religion again, what a fuss!

Anna


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