[ExI] People are Genuine Altruists, Sociopaths, or Confused/Moody

Lee Corbin lcorbin at rawbw.com
Sat Sep 13 06:45:40 UTC 2008


Harvey writes

> [Lee wrote]
> 
>> Let's say that with perfect impunity you can leave that restaurant you'll
>> never visit again in that distant city that you'll never visit it again.
>> Explain to me how it is in your self-interest, under these conditions,
>> to leave a tip.
> 
> This is silly.  I keep answering your questions, and you keep making them 
> more contrived to avoid my benefit.

This is a classic question---don't think that I invented it!

> Your latest contrivance only works if I never visit that city, or at least 
> that restaurant, again.  Great.  Now I have to keep a list of people and 
> places that I have cheated so that I can avoid them for the rest of my life. 
> It doesn't seem worth it to save a few measly bucks.

Hmm, I don't think that a truly selfish person practiced and intent
only on his own self-interest would have the least bit of trouble 
with weighing the simple likely outcomes. Of course, there are no
certainties in life, but he weighs his chances, and easily concludes
that it's exceedingly improbable that he'll ever want to visit *this*
restaurant in Paris in the future. And a proper tip may not be
"a few measly bucks", especially if he can't afford it easily the
way that you or I can.

> But I see a pattern here.

You are in security, after all. (Or---sorry, but I can't resist---just insecure?)

> So let's skip into the future where you have 
> contrived enough unlikely events that you get the answer you want.
> (I am starving to death in a strange city that is about to be destroyed by an 
> asteroid impact, I only have time to tip or teleport out of there, I forgot 
> my wallet anyway, and I realize that its a bad dream and I'm waking up.) 
> OK, so I finally concede that I don't always tip in every situation.  You 
> win.  So what's your response?  Is there any point to this line of 
> questioning when we get to the end?

So suspicious! Always worried about what a "yes" may lead to, eh?
I wonder if you were this way *before* taking up your line of work  :-)

> I also wonder if you cheat people all the time like you seem to be arguing 
> makes sense.

Certainly not. If you had read all my posts, you'd find that I take some
pride in being a genuine altruist. ("We are a better cut of people.", that
sort of thing.)

But it *does* make sense for someone who has only self-interest
at heart to avoid engaging in selfless acts, such as being unnecessarily
nice to people (beyond the call of reciprocation, genes, and reputation).
That's my claim: we who are really nice---and I had to make a
very determined thought experiment vividly portraying myself
and how I would act if I were the only real person in a simulated
world, and saw that indeed my behavior would change---us, we
do not always act out of self-interest.

> If so, why don't you explain why you do it rather than trying 
> to get me to explain why I don't.  Or if you don't cheat,
> why don't you reveal your reasons to us.

Done!  Well... let's say I very seldom cheat. As Solzhenitsyn
famously wrote, the line between good and evil cuts through
every human heart.

> And maybe if they are good enough for you they are good
> enough for the rest of us.  Is this going to turn out to be another 
> case where you actually agree with me (you don't cheat),
> but wanted to see my response to your thought experiments?

<sigh>, Merely trying to defend my claim above that we
genuine altruists frequently do *not* act in our own self-interest,
and have no intention of "correcting" the situation.

> And you aren't seriously trying to convince people
> that cheating is the best policy?

I am not speaking of a *policy*, per se. If you (incorrectly)
believe your behavior is ruled by a set of axioms, then
you might argue that you almost always follow a policy.
But most of us vacillate between principles, situation ethics,
and (like Mr. Bean when no one is looking), an occasional
greedy or lustful impulse.

But yes, I am indeed arguing that cheating under circumstances
where it is exceedingly unlikely anyone will know, defecting when
one cannot be caught at it, and never being the last to reciprocate,
are all in the person's best interest, modulo the obvious torments of
conscience in those of us that have them.

Lee




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