[ExI] The atoms red herring. =|

[Alan Grimes]

Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
> 2010/11/18 Alan Grimes <agrimes at speakeasy.net>:

>> So what? Who cares about the cat? I only care about me. The hidden magic
>> of uploading is that for it to be useful to the subject, the subject
>> must poses the supernatural power of being able to choose his point of
>> view. =P

> This position assumes that there is a subject over and above the
> matter contained in your brain or the information that matter
> represents. It would entail an entity that flits from body to body,
> determining that this one is you and that one is not (artificial
> destructive copying no, natural destructive copying yes). There is no
> evidence that such an entity exists and it is doubtful that the
> concept is even coherent. The reductionist view explains all
> observation and all experience simply and consistently.

What the hell is this argument about?

You will note that my response to postings has been selective because I
want this infernal thread to end. I am on this list in order to make
productive steps towards transhumanism. Here is a list of things wrong
with this thread:


1. We are not discussing important issues like how to form a coalition
determined to prevent ALL of the solar system from being turned into
computronium. I have no objection of any kind to SOME of the solar
system being used as computronium, perhaps even one or two full planets,
not all of them, and not Earth. Why is that such a difficult problem?

2. My position has never been that you should not upload. My position
has always been that I do not want to upload. I have done you the
courtesy of stating my reasons why, even though I have absolutely no
obligation to do so, or to defend my reasoning. I have made my choice,
it is now your responsibility to respect it. Why then, does this thread
continue without end even though ***YOU HAVE NO SKIN IN THE FIRE!!!***

3. So even though I have made no threats against you (I should, come to
think of it), you continue to harass me about my positions which are
self-evident within the ontologies I use to conduct my daily affairs,
compounded by the ultimatum "Either choose to upload or we will choose
for you!". Yes, that has been said, oh people who don't pay much attention.

4. I fully acknowledge that my interest in transhumanism is fueled by
the perpetual motion machine also known as my own personal deviations.
It is irrefutable that many other people in the movement are similarly
motivated. Why is it that some people's deviations and fetishes are
cherished while mine are disparaged to the point of saying that my
wishes should be completely ignored for no other reason than I don't get
a boner by thinking about computronium?

5. I have exhaustively reviewed every argument against uploading. It is
clear that you have selected an artificially narrowed world-view crafted
such that uploading naturally emerges from the system. Kurt Godel proved
that math is either incomplete or inconsistent. Science can tell you
what you might feel about something but it can't tell you what you
*SHOULD* feel about it. The only place you can obtain meaning and
purpose is through philosophy. (Some people try to obtain it through
religion but they suck). My philosophical claim here is that identity is
self-evident. It does not require a soul, it does not require atoms, it
does not require patterns, it exists because it exists, it exists, but
it's existence is not less real or significant than that of any emergent
property of any hand-picked assemblage of atoms. Why do you require that
I believe otherwise?


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