[ExI] the myth of the US "liberal media"

Kelly Anderson kellycoinguy at gmail.com
Sat Jul 16 07:43:32 UTC 2011


On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 4:27 PM, Stefano Vaj <stefano.vaj at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 14 July 2011 22:12, Kelly Anderson <kellycoinguy at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Tsarist Russia was a powerhouse too. I think at the best the
>> communists came near to recovering their Tzarist stature, briefly.
>
> Mmhhh, I beg to differ.

I guess it depends on what you think is important.

> Tsarist Russia *had been* a *regional* powerhouse. In the XIX century,
> in spite of its enormous resources and territory was more blatantly
> anachronistic than Japan, and in contrast to the latter did not seem
> on the way of any kind of recovery.

OK. My point is that Russia was a powerhouse at some point during the
Tsarist period. Whether they were at their peak power at the point
they were overthrown is rather irrelevant to the argument. Russia's
big boost onto the world scene actually dates back quite a way further
back than that, when they acted as the chief fence for the Vikings in
their pillaging of western Europe. Fun days... ;-)

> Fast-forward a little, and it industrialised at an incredible pace,
> even though admittedly by not keeping consumers too happy, won WWII
> (terrestrial contribution by US-UK was secondary at best...), quickly
> became the second world power in spite of the damages suffered,
> established egemony on eastern Europe, managed to colonise much of
> Siberia, developed leading space tech, etc.

They got lucky with stealing the atomic bomb. They did have tremendous
resources that they were able to bring to bear in WWII, no denying
that. A command economy is more compatible with the command structure
of a war. In fact, I think you could easily make the argument that the
USA also adapted it's economic style to something more akin to a
command economy during WWII. For example, the war department asking
Detroit for the Jeep, or Walt Disney for propaganda (ever seen Victory
Through Air Power (1943)?). Or asking EVERYONE and their dog to sell
war bonds, promote recycling, giving up nylons, fuel rationing, meat
rationing, etc.

The difference between Russia and the US in the 50s is more
pronounced. The US (appropriately, I think) turned back to consumerism
and making the populace happy for the fact that they had won the war.
The Russians on the other hand, continued a command economy on a war
footing, and were able to keep up and sometimes even beat the
Americans in technological and warfare issues. i.e. Sputnik, First man
to orbit earth, etc. But these covered up a suffering populace who
were being taxed heavily to support these activities.

The recent 60 minutes story on the East German's use of steroids and
other medications to cheat at the Olympics showed what was typical, An
all cost propaganda machine promoting the socialist state, nevermind
what it cost the athletes.

> The decline did not start with Stalin, let alone Lenin, in spite of
> how little love Ayn Rand may have had for them. It started in the
> Kruscev era, and even more importantly during Breznev's stagnant
> gerontocracy. In this respect, Russian transhumanists do recognise
> that for long years commies had been anything but neoluddites
> ("Soviets plus electricity"...), and that fundamental research and its
> players enjoyed there a much higher status than in most other
> countries.

True, because that is what supported the military state. You can have
a state that is primarily militarily focused, and become a world
power, FOR A WHILE. But then Reagan outspent them, and the rest of
their economy could not keep up with the necessary expenditures, and
they imploded. For this one thing, I put Reagan as either a genius or
the luckiest bastard who ever lived.

The Socialism in America, take from the rich, give to the poor,
enabling them to stay poor forever... is just an alternative model to
the Soviet Socialism, take from the rich, build the military, enabling
everyone to stay poor forever... Same dance style, different tune.

-Kelly



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