[ExI] Brief correction re Western Democracies [WASI am Call To Libertarians]

Rafal Smigrodzki rafal.smigrodzki at gmail.com
Sat Mar 5 14:16:37 UTC 2011

On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 2:29 AM, Kelly Anderson <kellycoinguy at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 7:55 PM, Rafal Smigrodzki
> <rafal.smigrodzki at gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 11:59 AM, Damien Sullivan
>> <phoenix at ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote:
>>> I'm a bit bemused by the libertarian enthusiasm for private toll roads.
>>> I mean, yes, it's a way to get roads built, but is a society full of
>>> piecemeal tolls, and possibilities to be denied passage by a road owner
>>> whod oesn't like you, actually desirable?  How does an economy of tolls
>>> everywhere compare to that of a free travel zone?
>> ### If the owner of all roads doesn't like you, where will you go? On
>> the other hand, if the owner of one road doesn't like too many people,
>> he will soon run out of toll money.
> Can you think of a current toll road/bridge/whatever that denies
> passage to some people other than on the basis that they can't or
> won't pay? What makes you think that this would happen in reality? It
> seems pretty easy for the government to regulate toll roads to the
> extent that they are not able to discriminate on any basis other than
> something legitimate, like being overweight, over-sized, unpaid,
> criminals, or possibly a few other things I haven't thought of.

### Maybe I was too cryptic but I actually wrote in support of private
toll roads (and willy-nilly also government ones, better than
government non-toll roads). What I meant that commercial private toll
roads are unlikely to be used for any discriminatory purposes because
denying use for what most of us would see as illegitimate reason
(race, gender, sexual orientation) would cut into the income of the
owner. I also pointed out that having single-entity ownership of all
roads can be tricky - as many Russians found, in a totalitarian state
you couldn't travel without state permission which as they tell me,
sucked. But really I am all on your side, just need to be less
convoluted in my locutions.


> Tolls everywhere is freedom, not free. A free travel zone, by which I
> assume you mean our current "free" highways, is not free, NOR is it
> freedom. It is government seized land, built into a highway with
> government seized money, and even they deny passage to some traffic,
> such as overweight trucks. (I don't necessarily object to the
> government seizing land for the building of highways under some
> circumstances, but eminent domain is one area where the government
> often over reaches.)
### I actually came to strongly believe that eminent domain of any
kind is absolutely wrong.


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