[extropy-chat] MNT and energy. (was Re: Social Implications of Nanotech)

[Mike Lorrey]

--- Dan Clemmensen <dgc at cox.net> wrote:
> Mike Lorrey wrote:
> 
> >--- Dan Clemmensen <dgc at cox.net> wrote:
> >  
> >
> >>When I said I do not advocate solar, geothermal, and sophisticated 
> >>conservation using current technology,  I was referring to a purely
> 
> >>local implementation.
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >Local as in what? That is a rather broad brush, don't you think?
> >There are actually quite a number of local areas where solar is
> >extremely cost effective, specifically in more remote locales where
> >grid access is not at all cost effective. Essentially, if you have
> >to spend more than $10k to get grid electric service to your
> > dwelling, then solar is
> >more cost effective, and that is just photovoltaic. Passive solar is
> >actually even more cost effective, as it doesn't require expensive
> >solar cells, doesn't produce toxic chemicals as waste of the
> >manufacturing process, and enjoys a practical efficiency 3-8 times
> >higher than photovoltaic systems, though it is essentially only
> >applicable to heating and cooling.
> >
> Sorry, Mike. I was actually generalizing from a VREY local
> perspective, namely my current house. I already have an electrical
> service entrance and natural gas service. I live in a big house on
> a 2-acre lot in the suburbs, and I am fairly lazy. I live at
> approximately 39 deg 2 minutes N, 77 deg 18 min W (suburbs of
> Washington DC.) East coast boreal forest,

I'm in NH, more than 500 miles north of you. I know a large number of
people who live in rural areas and are entirely off-grid. While in-town
electricity costs average 14 cents a kwh here, when building rurally,
especially more than a hundred yards from the grid, you get a
significant bill from the power company to run service to your dwelling
(still significant if you pay an electrical contractor to do it for
you). Figure a base of $3k plus another grand for every telephone pole
they have to put in (burying it is more expensive).

Since propane/natural gas appliances are actually more energy efficient
than electrical appliances (at least in the heating arena), you can
remove your hot water heater, your stove, half your clothes dryer load,
all of your HVAC as well as your refrigerator from your electrical
needs and save more money doing it with a very short payback period,
typically 2 years or so, nowhere near the 20 years you assert (though
the payback will be worse, about 4 years, if you finance it, of
course).

With these significant loads removed from your electrical needs, all of
your lighting, computer, washing machine, and other appliance needs can
be met with a solar installation costing about $10k, installed. Nor is
this 'exotic technology', especially to contractors who deal with this
on a regular basis. When you purchase your system, the manufacturer can
provide you with lists of contractors in your area that are experienced
with this technology.

As for what percent of the population lives in cost-effective areas?
Consider that half the population of the US lives in rural areas.

=====
Mike Lorrey
"Live Free or Die, Death is not the Worst of Evils."
                                       - Gen. John Stark
"Fascists are objectively pro-pacifist..."
                                       - Mike Lorrey
Do not label me, I am an ism of one...
Sado-Mikeyism: http://mikeysoft.zblogger.com

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