[extropy-chat] Oxygenating the flame in threads

Tue Aug 30 02:15:54 UTC 2005

Oh, that's so defeatist! I think that a simple karma system could be
implemented pretty merrily on top of a listserv. I'm thinking now (I
think Eugen might have suggested this) urls in the email at the bottom
for "Thumbs up", "Thumbs down", so that clicking the link would bring
up a web browser saying "thanks your vote has been recorded" - that
simple. Maybe you put a unique id on each email (does that already
exist somewhere accessible in existing listserv software?), the links
give just include that id as a parameter. Thus the mechanism works in
individual and digest mode correctly.

Plus, you can still have the concept of "exi-crap" and "exi-great"
addresses to wholesale forward emails to, so that things are
automatable. They'd count as clicking "Thumbs up" or "Thumbs down".

You might then include some metrics in the posts themselves, although
they are necessarily historical (ie: they rate the postor, not the
post). You could always have a website with more detailed information
available (which can sit and show its info to the "0 users currently
logged in".

-- 
Emlyn

http://emlynoregan.com   * blogs * music * software *

On 30/08/05, Brian Lee <brian_a_lee at hotmail.com> wrote:
> I saw the suggestions and read them and they seem pretty valid. But the
> schemes I saw are non-intuitive and the "web forum" is a pretty well
> established artifact. There's no need to try to shove the whole forum
> concept into a listserv. If you want listserv stick with email. If you want
> karma and buddies and hard topics, etc switch to a forum.
> 
> BAL
> 
> >From: Samantha Atkins <sjatkins at mac.com>
> >To: ExI chat list <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
> >Subject: Re: [extropy-chat] Oxygenating the flame in threads
> >Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 12:08:20 -0700
> >
> >No you don't.  Look at my email forwarding with decorations idea as  well
> >as the ideas of others already expressed in this thread.
> >
> >On Aug 28, 2005, at 2:52 PM, Brian Lee wrote:
> >
> >>In order to create a reputation based list, you really need to set  up a
> >>forum site a la slashdot/kur5hin/plastic/etc. This gives you
> >>karma/whuffie/whatever, filtering and all the stuff you're talking  about.
> >>Of course then you lose the simplicity of email.
> >>
> >>BAL
> >>
> >>
> >>>From: Natasha Vita-More <natasha at natasha.cc>
> >>>To: ExI chat list <extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org>
> >>>CC: board at extropy.org
> >>>Subject: Re: [extropy-chat] Oxygenating the flame in threads
> >>>Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:43:40 -0500
> >>>
> >>>I'd like to implement a reputation system, or some other  intelligent
> >>>system to value posters and threads and encourage  optimum discussions
> >>>and debates.  And I think that Board should  discuss this with the list
> >>>moderators.
> >>>
> >>>Natasha
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>(sending it a second time, I haven't seen it appear yet)
> >>>>
> >>>>Emlyn:
> >>>>
> >>>>>What you could possibly do is set up an email address - say
> >>>>>extropy-crap at lists.extropy.org. People could forward email they
> >>>>>disliked to that address, as a vote against it. Instead of  killfiling
> >>>>>someone, you could forward their entire output to that address,  as a
> >>>>>permanent mark of disdain!
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>I guess you'd also want an extropy-great at lists.extropy.org,  to send
> >>>>>excellent posts and favoured postors to.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Dear Emlyn,
> >>>>
> >>>>I think that this is a great idea. I would use it.  And I don't
> >>>>think that this strategy is difficult for the average user either,
> >>>>because it would just take a few seconds to 'express yourself'. I
> >>>>think that the posters who poison the list should know that the
> >>>>readers don't like their words. I think that large feedback is
> >>>>sorely needed here, in order to improve list quality and encourage
> >>>>good people to return, and I think that assigning reputation is a
> >>>>very good first step. Reputation, in free places, greases the  cogs of
> >>>>the human interchange machinery. How else can buyers evaluate a
> >>>>purchase, and how else can sellers know when they are doing a good
> >>>>job? Reputation and Feeback.
> >>>>
> >>>>Presently, if you are a 'seller' of a message on the extropy-chat
> >>>>list, you'll put your message out there. Feedback for messages here
> >>>>is occasionally a conversational thread, but more often, a flaming
> >>>>thread. Flaming threads require alot more time than assigning 0 or
> >>>>negative to the reputation of the seller, and many opt-out of
> >>>>wanting to spend that time. A simple reputation assignment
> >>>>encourages more to express their opinion of that person's words.
> >>>>More opinions gives more information to the seller that their
> >>>>strategy is effective or not. If the seller discovers that their
> >>>>strategy for 'selling their message' is not effective, then s/he can
> >>>>continue, but it should be clear to her/him that s/he is wasting
> >>>>her/his time on the list (and that person is being willfully
> >>>>ignorant). And/or the list owners (Extropy _is_ the owner of the
> >>>>list), have a very good reason, based on reliable information, to
> >>>>remove that poster.
> >>>>
> >>>>In the early 1990s days of the extropians list, we discussed
> >>>>reputation systems often (in fact Robin's sig line was "Stake Your
> >>>>Reputation"). Think carefully about how important are reputations.
> >>>>The best decisions one makes for one's life in some way uses this
> >>>>data, does it not? For the simplest example of reputations-in- action:
> >>>>look to Ebay: would you want to buy a product from someone who had
> >>>>less than a 98% customer satisfaction? The feedback from Ebay users
> >>>>to push the number so high is astounding when you think about it.
> >>>>
> >>>>Amara
> >>>>
> >>>>--
> >>>>
> >>>>********************************************************************
> >>>>Amara Graps, PhD          email: amara at amara.com
> >>>>Computational Physics     vita:  ftp://ftp.amara.com/pub/resume.txt
> >>>>Multiplex Answers         URL:   http://www.amara.com/
> >>>>********************************************************************
> >>>>"Nothing is more terrible than to see ignorance in action."
> >>>>  ---Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>extropy-chat mailing list
> >>>>extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org
> >>>>http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo/extropy-chat
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>><http://www.natasha.cc/>Natasha <http://www.natasha.cc/>Vita-More
> >>>Cultural Strategist, Designer
> >>>Studies of the Future, University of Houston
> >>>President, <http://www.extropy.org/>Extropy Institute
> >>>Founder, <http://www.transhumanist.biz/>Transhumanist Arts & Culture
> >>>
> >>>Knowledge is the most democratic source of power.  Alvin Toffler
> >>>Random acts of kindness... Anne Herbet
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>extropy-chat mailing list
> >>>extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org
> >>>http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo/extropy-chat
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
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> >>http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo/extropy-chat
> >>
> >
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> >extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org
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> 
> 
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