[extropy-chat] Muslim Machinations (was Protect ourselves to prevent a return to the middle ages)

[The Avantguardian]

--- ben <benboc at lineone.net> wrote:

> Wow, i don't think i've ever had such mixed feelings
> about such a
> heavy-duty rant. On one hand, this IS obviously
> foaming at the mouth 
> (and from a self-confessed raelian!), but on the
> other, a lot of the 
> things presented are, afaik, true.

It is a frustrating problem and obviously the time
when one can safely bury ones head in the sand about
the matter has passed. This one isn't going away on
its own, folks.

> I think this is a
> cue to find some 
> things out for myself. I knew about the apostasy
> thing, which is bad 
> enough, but some of the others?
> Do present-day muslims really think that it's right
> and proper to beat 
> women that they suspect might not obey them?

Of course, not too long ago a Muslim girl in Germany
was beaten to death by her own brothers for dressing
like "a German whore". 

> 
> Of course, if you read the old testament you'll get
> a lot of dodgy stuff
> as well, but who actually lives by that?

Well that is a amjor difference between Christianity
and Islam. The Bible is an anthology that was pieced
together, edited, and translated for two and a half
millenia. It has writings by numerous people who were
writing in different languages at different historical
periods. Thus it is filled with contradictions. 

The Koran on the other hand, was written in its
entirity by a single man (Mohammed) writing in one
language, Arabic. Thus the Koran does not contradict
itself and therefore it is logically easier to take it
literally.  
 
> Maybe it's time to hit the bookshop and stock up on
> islamic holy books 
> (now /there's/ something i never thought i'd ever
> say!)

Been there and done that. I also noted that there are
no "approved" translations of the Koran i.e. no Koran
not written in Arabic is considered legitimate. If you
do get a translation, however, you will find that
aside from some very pretty prose, it is a very
restrictive religion. Moreover if you read about the
biography of Mohammed you will learn that  
he was distict from most prophets because he was both
a secular ruler and a spirtual leader- Buddha, Moses,
and Jesus all had a similar choice and all chose the
spiritual path over over the path of worldly power.

Moses was the adopted son of the Egyptian phaoroah.
Buddha was an Indian prince. And Jesus was of the
house of David and enough of a threat to Herod to have
Herod kill off male children. Mohammed, however,
refused to compromise his will to power. He
slaughtered whole tribes of his fellow Arab bedouins
that refused to acknowledge him as the word of God. He
wanted both the riches of the earth AND the souls 
of his adherents. Thus Islam from its very beginning
was a designed as a theocracy and theocracy is at the
heart of Koranic dogma.

You kill, enslave, or convert the infidel, there is no
wiggle room for tolerance. That is not to say that ALL
Muslims are intolerant, but that is because the 
tolerant ones are smart enough to realize the Koran
was written by a man and not because there is anything
in the Koran to suggest any degree of tolerance toward
the infidel. Moreover, the tolerant ones are
considered to be illegitimate Muslims by the religious
heirarchy.

That the Muslim leadership are machinating against the
governments of the west, there can be no doubt. Why
else would it take over a year for cartoons in Denmark
to galvanize the Muslim communities around the world?

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/09/international/middleeast/09cartoon.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1&th&emc=th

It was decided by the Organization of the Islamic
Conference that this would be the time to rally
Muslims around the world against Freedom. And have no
doubt, they will use the tools of Freedom like liberal
moral and cultural relativism against it. The imperial
march of Mohammed never stopped, it has only been
waiting. 

You can have freedom of religion and you can have
separation of church and state, but all it takes is a
religion that denies any separation between church and
state and you have Freedom's Achilles Heel. 
These are dangerous times. The future is in motion and
I cannot see it with any certainty. The loss of
religious freedom, the loss of separation of church
and state, or the loss of both are all very real
possibilities.

I am reminded of a Bene Gesserit proverb from Frank
Herbert's Dune:

"When religion and politics travel in the same cart,
the riders believe nothing can stand in their way.
Their movement becomes headlong — faster and faster
and faster. They put aside all thought of obstacles
and forget that a precipice does not show itself to
the man in a blind rush until it's too late."




Stuart LaForge
alt email: stuart"AT"ucla.edu

"Thereupon, the Soul of Mother Earth bewailed, Should I accept the support of a feeble man and listen to his words? In fact I desired the aid of a strong and mighty king. When shall such a person arise and bring strong-handed succor to me?" -Yasna 29, verse 9 

"Now I am light, now I am flying, now I see myself beneath myself, now a God dances through me." - St. Nietzsche

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com