[extropy-chat] a.k.a is..

Samantha Atkins sjatkins at mac.com
Thu Mar 9 02:56:30 UTC 2006

On Mar 8, 2006, at 7:05 AM, Jef Allbright wrote:

> Samantha -
> My comment and question to Anne-Marie was not kind, but neither was it
> intended to be unkind.
> I've noticed and known some people who appear to share two two
> attributes:  (1) They tend to spew words in a kind of disjointed,
> stream of consciousness way, making connections and asserting
> significance while lacking much semblance to critical thinking. (2)
> They have used LSD for significant periods of their life.

Actually you seem to be talking about different ways of speaking/ 
experiencing and denying implicitly that ones different than what you  
habitually or preferentially use have much value or even implying  
that they are pathological.  A relatively metaphorical and poetic  
flow state is not without value just because we value rationality.    
It has nothing to do per se with using this or that drug.  Some drugs  
make it easier to experience and explore certain types of consciousness.

> In my opinion and experience, altered states of consciousness, whether
> induced by meditation, medication, intoxication, or psychotropic
> substances, can be sometimes useful for helping people break out of a
> rut in their current mode of thinking, and can be useful for
> experiencing how illusory ones sense of self, perceptions and values
> can be.

Yes, among other things.

> Such experiences can also be a driver of creativity after, but not
> usually during, the altered state. Likewise, since such altered states
> are highly subjective and thus of little direct value to others it
> would be discourteous to post to most public forums in such a mode.

I don't see why unless again you claim some states are suspect or  
relatively useless.

> In the case of this poster on our list I have seen multiple examples
> of (what seem to me) incoherent thought with the kind of ecstatic
> mystical and erratic emotional attributes characteristic of such drug
> influence.

This is very judgmental and damaging to our community in my opinion.   
I happen to be a born mystic in that ecstatic and mystical states  
came easily to me from early childhood.  I also learned to develop my  
logical and rational side.  But I don't despise either way of being/ 
experiencing and I have personally been damaged by attempting to  
choose one aspect and deny the other many times in my life.   I also  
don't believe you can justify your derogatory opinion of drugs such  
as LSD.  That is a discussion we have had before here.  Lastly I  
don't believe it is appropriate to silence a poster as not conforming  
to your preferred type of consciousness.   I have seen Anne-Marie  
post in many different styles.  That is one thing I enjoy about her  
presence here.

- samantha

More information about the extropy-chat mailing list