[ExI] fermi paradox- weighted summary

[Kevin Freels]

Whether interstellar travel is practical in the future or for other 
beings, it doesn't change the fact that the paradox is due to a lack of 
any real information rather than do to facts that conflict. So it's not 
a paradox. The discussion of isolation, travel, time, space, evolution 
and beings destroying each other is simply pointless without more facts.

BillK wrote:
> On Dec 6, 2007 2:57 PM, Eugen Leitl wrote:
>   
>> On Thu, Dec 06, 2007 at 02:36:15PM +0000, BillK wrote:
>>
>> Self-replicating technology, phased array radiators with lightminute
>> aperture and gray sail probes are not exactly off-the wall.
>>
>> Why would any culture be limited to presently available technology?
>>
>>     
>
> But these technologies only exist in speculation. They *may* be
> possible in the future, if society decides to spend resources in those
> directions and no insurmountable problems (technical or sociological)
> occur. If you are relying on unknown technology, then you can
> speculate all you like, but that doesn't make it a likely possibility.
>
>
>   
>> Any self-rep systems will become visible over astronomical
>> distances, given a mere few megayears.
>>     
>
> Well we can't see them, so we might as well assume they probably don't exist.
>
>   
>> Huge? Energy density less than a fusion weapon. And of course
>> you leave the drive at home.
>>
>>     
>
> You need the equivalent to stop at the other end.
> And you are assuming that a civilization will want to build these
> useless devices in the first place.
> (Useless, because at vast expense the civilisation gets no benefit).
>
>   
>> Why would you need radiation shielding at mere 0.9 c? Why would
>> you not rather self-heal all the time?
>>
>>     
>
> Self-heal? Against continual near-lightspeed cosmic radiation and
> dust? I think not.
> I thought you were all in favour of robot space exploration anyway,
> because of these and other problems.
>
>
>   
>> If you think darwinian systems are insane, welcome to the loony bin.
>>
>>     
>
> You well know that humans have finished with darwinian evolution
> already and we're not particularly advanced yet. Our first world
> peoples have already stopped breeding and are dying out and extending
> the life span of remaining members. They may, for a short period, be
> replaced by faster breeding nations, but they in turn will follow the
> same path. Advanced intelligence (or advanced civilisation) means very
> low reproductive rates.
> (Sure, it's only evidence of one intelligent species as an example,
> but that's one more than you have as evidence for the alternative).
>
> There are speculations about grey goo eating everything, nano-robots
> expanding at lightspeed eating the universe, etc.  But we don't see
> any of that, so why give much credence to such ideas?
>
> It's far more likely that advanced civilisations don't breed much,
> don't expand, and keep themselves to themselves. For many reasons,
> including Seth's latest article.
>
> BillK
> _______________________________________________
> extropy-chat mailing list
> extropy-chat at lists.extropy.org
> http://lists.extropy.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/extropy-chat
>
>
>   
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.extropy.org/pipermail/extropy-chat/attachments/20071206/bf5ac53b/attachment.html>