[ExI] Pride and/or thinking superior

[Anna Taylor]

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Emlyn <emlynoregan at gmail.com> wrote:

>Well no, I don't agree with that. I think you could be
>lost on a desert island (or be transformed into an M-Brain hanging
>darkly in space), and still exist. If you take a more solipsistic
>viewpoint, the rest of the universe fails to exist for you, rather than
>the other way around.

Well then we will agree to disagree.  I think I am but a mere reflection of everything I have seen, heard, tasted but I know I only know how to interpret based on others reflections.  Although you may exist on an island, if nobody ever knew you did, you wouldn't exist.

>The need for acknowledgement from others is, to my mind, one of the great >binding forces that holds humanity back from what it could be.

Please explain why.  IMO, pride has nothing to do with the acknowledgement of others, it has to do with the respect for others that in turn has led to pride. 

>The dreadful hierarchical monkey tribe social structures that persist >from antiquity are firmly bedded on the need for approval from other >people. 

Funny that the same hierarchical monkey tribe social structures have worked for lifetimes.  Maybe the need to change these "hierarchical monkey tribes" would be more efficient than removing them.  Groups don't exist without hierarchical positions, otherwise everyone thinks they are a boss.

>If I had to pick a simple program for finding inner peace, it would be to >free oneself from exactly that impulse. But I am not the first person to >say that, real or mythical.

I agree that not everyone will like you, this has nothing to do with pride.  The need for approval falls under the category of self-confidence.  Pride is the respect given to those that teach something to others.  

>That said, we are social creatures, and Humans v1.0 can be
>severely diminished creatures without social contact. But it depends
>on the individual. Some of the greatest minds are indeed islands.

Although an interesting metaphor, there is really no such thing as uniqueness.

>Pride can have positive and negative connotations. 

Maybe but pride is supposed to be an essence of respect.  So I would start to ponder what do I respect if I where looking at finding the negative and positive.  

>It's good in measured doses. Without it, one can drift, unable to find
>enough meaning to focus. Too much, and you wander into the territory of >arrogance, or jingoism, and your thoughts become resistant to change.

Imho, what that means is that you are longer feeling pride. In my experience, once you wonder into the territory of arrogance the only pride you could have is the fact that you have learned to get yourself out of that position.  Which in turn is usually due to the credit of others.

>In fact, I'd say pride is often part of the toolbox of
>our more prevalent memetic infections. It's humorous really that
>Christianity warns us against it :-)

Fine.  What are these prevalent memetic infections you talk about?  Christianity warns about everything, from the most absurb to the most crucial, I believe that they had to jam so much information into one book that they forgot to let people know exactly what they where warning against:)

> And, of course, why you are proud is as important as how
> proud you are; that can reveal it as sustenance or poison. imo.

No I disagree.  Having pride is something that is passed on, learned.  Proud of yourself is self-accomplishments.  A rapist may may feel pride by raping someone but is it really the right word?  

> Again, just joking around.

Ok, my apology, sometimes it's hard on Extropy to figure out when people are joking as opposed to being serious:)

Have a great evening, 
Anna







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