[ExI] Ketman

[Rafal Smigrodzki]

On Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 12:45 PM, painlord2k at libero.it
<painlord2k at libero.it> wrote:

> How do I differentiate from a "moderate" Muslim from a "extremist" Muslim?
> Many purported "moderate" Muslims are so only when they are speaking in
> a western language to westerns, but they are "extremists" when they
> speak in Arabic to Muslims. This is know like al-Taqiyya/Dissimulation
> or Ketman (also spelled Kitman)
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketman
>
>> Ketman (Arabic kitmān كتمان "secrecy, concealment") is the act of
>> paying lip service to authority while holding personal opposition.
>> It is a sort of political or religious camouflage, for the purpose
>> of survival, because, if you said publicly that you are against those
>> in power, the consequences for you and your family would be
>> immediate and catastrophic. So you can teach your children, in deep
>> secrecy, to practice ketman exactly the same as you, but never to
>> forget the real truth, as you see it. This can go on through many
>> generations, and erupt one distant day in the form of revolutions,
>> uprisings, etc.
>>
>> Though the term was originally used exclusively in regards to
>> Islamic authority, the term is most frequently encountered in
>> reference to Communist authoritarianism.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiyya
>
>> Within the Shia theological framework,[1] the concept of Taqiyya
>> (تقية - 'fear, guard against', also taghiyeh)[2] refers to a
>> dispensation allowing believers to conceal their faith when under
>> threat, persecution or compulsion.[3]
>>
>> The word "al-Taqiyya" literally means: "Concealing or disguising
>> one's beliefs, convictions, ideas, feelings, opinions, and/or
>> strategies at a time of imminent danger, whether now or later in
>> time, to save oneself from physical and/or mental injury." A one-word
>> translation would be "dissimulation." [4]
>
> http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter6b/1.html
>
> MEMRI is there with so many translations showing only this. Many
> "undercover" reporters recorded hateful sermons inside mainstream
> Mosques in Europe and in the USA. And when confronted, the leaders of
> the Mosques talk about "He was let preaching without supervision because
> he take out the trash from the Mosque; not our fault." or other nonsense.
>

### Do you realize that your post is literally incoherent? You start
out by arguing that in principle you cannot tell the difference
between nice Muslims and asshole Muslims (which, if true, could be a
reason to treat them all alike) but then you justify this claim by
quoting persons who actually were able to tell the difference ("many
undercover reporters"). So which is it?

This reminds me of the Jewish question. I mean, all reasonable people
know that Jews use Christian baby blood to make matzoh, and especially
Jewesses eat a lot of it when they lay their eggs. Sure, there could
be a non-blood-sucking Jew or two, but how do we tell the difference?
They all stick together, so we really have to gas them. Or else
Christian babies will continue to get snatched away and eaten! Do you
want Christian babies to be eaten?

(Just to avoid misunderstandings, the previous paragraph was just
vituperative satire a la Borat, not an expression of my beliefs).

Painlord, I know you can think clearly, you are a smart dude, your
posts about economics show it but it looks like that tribal stuff is
messing you up.

Rafal