[ExI] Left Behind

Will Steinberg asyluman at gmail.com
Fri May 22 19:04:24 UTC 2009

Seems like a huge conflict in this sorta transhumanist talk concerns
pragmatism and progress versus romanticism.  The problem is that everyone
who is smart enough to think about this stuff also tends to be cultured
enough to love things like forests and books and history.  We are so
unwilling to let go of these humanist instincts--because the movement
focuses on transcending humanity and thus produces a whole
conflicty-dialectical-esque deal.

When viewed in a wider, panprogressivist style, we can think about letting
go of humanity as a step along a gradient, much like leaving for college or
a similar shift.  The notion of transhumanism is as subjective as they get
simply because it puts so much emphasis

On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 2:48 PM, Aware <aware at awareresearch.com> wrote:

> On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 11:39 AM, Stefano Vaj <stefano.vaj at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Jef Allbright <jef at jefallbright.net>
> wrote:
> >> Giulio, nearly everyone in these futurist forums (and nearly everyone
> >> else too) shares this desire for more in the way of the sensual
> >> pleasures you list.  But I think it's worth pointing out, that more
> >> coherently, there is no distinct or essential "you", separate from the
> >> meat, and the very sensual desires you express are *defined* by the
> >> nature of the "meat" within the current cultural context.
> >
> > Not so sure. Even today, there are, e.g., sex-related pleasure
> > (seduction, e.g., or some forms of cybersex) where the "meat" is not
> > really involved.
> Was referring to drives, encoded via evolutionary processes in the
> "meat" organism (including its brain and nervous system), regardless
> of the interface or interaction.
> I have no problem, conceptually, morally or otherwise, with
> "upgrading" the embodiment (not just the substrate) , but I would
> argue that this will also "upgrade" the "self" and all that entails.
> - Jef
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