[ExI] Meaningless Symbols.

The Avantguardian avantguardian2020 at yahoo.com
Thu Jan 14 02:34:42 UTC 2010



----- Original Message ----
> From: Stathis Papaioannou <stathisp at gmail.com>
> To: gordon.swobe at yahoo.com; ExI chat list <extropy-chat at lists..extropy.org>
> Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 5:56:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [ExI] Meaningless Symbols.
> 

> The problem is that you can't explain how humans get their
> understanding. It doesn't help to say that some physical activity
> happens in neurons which produces the understanding, not because you
> haven't given the details of the physical activity, but because you
> haven't explained how, in general terms, it is possible for the
> physical activity in a brain to pull off that trick but not the
> physical activity in a computer. Even if it's true that computers only
> do syntax and syntax can't produce meaning (it isn't, since logically
> there is nowhere else for meaning to come from) this does not mean
> that computers can't produce meaning.

*China room no important me say*

 If you can understand that, then syntax is not all that relevant to human understanding at a fundamental level. A similarly scrambled statement in any scripting language that I can think of would have caused the program to halt. Yet your brain takes it stride and understands. *This* is what I think is fascinating.  

> It would be like saying brains
> only do chemistry and chemistry can't produce meaning. In the course
> of the chemistry brains manipulate symbols and that's where the
> meaning comes from if you believe meaning can only come from symbol
> manipulation; and in the course of manipulating symbols computers are
> physically active and that's where the meaning comes from if you
> believe meaning can only come from physical activity.

Brains, being part of the real world, do it all. Chemistry is merely a model that simplifies a small part of what reality does so that we can discuss it and think about it. But there are things that the universe does for which there are not yet words, symbols, or concepts. Imagine trying to explain "quantum erasure" to Plato in ancient Greek and you will see what I am getting at.  

Stuart LaForge 


"Science has not yet mastered prophecy. We predict too much for the next year and yet far too little for the next ten." - Neil Armstrong


      




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