[ExI] Cryonics is getting weird

[spike]

> ...On Behalf Of Jeff Davis
> 
> On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 6:24 PM, The Avantguardian 
> <avantguardian2020 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > .... the corpses of Eva Peron and Lenin, who were so well 
> embalmed that they showed no signs of putrefecation years 
> after they died."
> 
> Hot damn! Daniel.  Thank you.  I hadn't thought along those 
> lines at all -- chemical fixation by formaldehyde -- but of 
> course, you're right...
> Chemical fixation and dessication/drying have on occasion be 
> suggested as alternatives to low temp (ie cryo) preservation. 

...
Ja, if there is any merit to it at all, a few dozen gallons of formaldehyde
would be muuuch cheaper than liquid nitrogen.  I can imagine a scenario
where the notion of formaldehyde preservation has not been seriously
revisited since the late 1980s when the K.Eric's work caused many to take
seriously for the first time the notion of cryonics.

Perhaps early cryonicists were still under the hopeless notion that the meat
itself would somehow be revived.  Clearly any formaldehyde soaked brain
would no longer think, now or forever.  But if nanobots are used to read the
configuration of the brain, then it is at least vaguely conceivable that a
formaldehyde preserved brain could be read and simulated in software.

Keith, does the cryonet crowd ever talk about formaldehyde preservation?  Is
there some intermediate stage, such as formaldehyde at -30C?  How about
formaldehyde preservation in the short term, for a few days, until the Alcor
team can get assembled?  Could we use formaldehyde in the home of the
patient in the short term, lower the temp to about -85C (formaldehyde
freezes at about -90) after which the Alcor team could arrive and replace
the formaldehyde with first cold freon, then liquid nitrogen?  Or just keep
the patient at -85C in formaldehyde, and tolerate the thermal damage over
time?  Or keep the patient in a formaldehyde filled seal-a-meal bag
submerged in a mixture of freon 22 and methane?  Or the formaldehyde
submerged in pure freon 22 at about a quarter of an atmosphere, so that the
freon keeps the formaldehyde patient in a seal-a-meal at about -80C, inside
a closed system?

Reasoning: if you go with the -80ish temps, the surface area of the
preservation container isn't nearly as critical as with the -196 nitrogen.
The energy to maintain would be about a quarter as much, ja?

Keith how much do the cryonet people talk about alternatives to the
traditional liquid nitrogen in a dewar?

> 
> ... Hurrah!  I really feel a lot better about this now...

Ok good, now we have seven reluctant quad 4ers and one cheerful 4er.  {8^D

Jeff your optimism is refreshing.  I consider the quad 4 outcome as a black
eye for cryonics in general, but I sure can't figure out what the hell Alcor
could have done any differently under these difficult circumstances.  Tanya
and colleagues, we are behind you, and cheering still.  Alcor just didn't
have any good options in this painful case.  Most of the blame is on Mr.
Richardson's family, with the rest of it being on Mr. Richardson, for not
alerting Alcor as to his difficult situation.  Do let us hope we have
learned from this unfortunate episode, and may we as a species improve and
advance from this tragedy.

spike