[ExI] solar is looking better all the time: was RE: Efficiency of wind power

[Emlyn]

2011/4/7 spike <spike66 at att.net>:
>
>
>
>
> From: extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org
> [mailto:extropy-chat-bounces at lists.extropy.org] On Behalf Of Max More
>
>
>
>>>Some interesting data on the (low) efficiency of wind power:
>
>
>
>>>http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/04/06/whoa-windfarms-in-uk-operate-well-below-advertised-efficiency/#more-37420
>
> --- Max
>
>
>
>>…  It is something that burned an image into my retinas: most of the time
>> in most of those wind farms, all of the turbines were sitting still and
>> quiet.  spike
>
>
>
>
>
> I gave you some bad news, now I will give you something good.
>
>
>
> This past weekend I was at a class reunion for Shelly’s high school, in
> Caldwell Idaho where she is from.  We went to a big party out north and west
> past Vale Oregon.  Driving out to the ranch of some old friends, I was
> struck by how much land there is where there is insufficient water resources
> to grow much of anything, no civilization, harsh climate, clear, windy most
> of the time, but there is a road and some existing power infrastructure.
> There is no reason whatsoever we couldn’t make a mile wide field of PVs on
> either side of the road going up highway 26 from Vale and out highway 20
> west of Vale, south from Marsing on highway 95, where one goes for hour
> after hour seeing on either side of the road to the horizon, flat unused
> ground, un-farmable, unbuildable.  There is sooooo damn much wide open land
> out there, being used for nothing, useful for nothing else.
>
>
>
> If you have a few days to mess around, I do encourage those who worry about
> mankind’s future energy resources to get in a Detroit and drive out to some
> of these desert wastelands, just to get a feel for how open and vast they
> are.  Go down highway 395 in eastern Oregon and California, or go nearly
> anywhere in Nevada.  Plenty of open space out there, and the land is
> practically free.  We could add enormous power lines, or set up coal to
> octane plants out there to soak up the peak production.  If you don’t have
> time to drive out there, go on Google maps, enter Ontario Oregon, look
> around.
>
>
>
> If we really committed to doing this, we could set up solar panel fabs that
> would produce standardized 1 meter by 1 meter panels in quantities that
> would give manufacturing engineers the tingles.  We would churn out so many
> of these things, we could get very close to lights-out factories.  Over a
> couple decades we could gradually replace so many of the alternative energy
> sources, all of which have their severe shortcomings.  We could end up with
> enough with enough spare energy to use the excess to synthesize ammonium
> nitrate for fertilizers, octane for our Detroits, power air conditioning to
> counteract global warming, all that stuff.
>
>
>
> The wind farms haven’t lived up to their promise, geothermal and falling
> water are nearly completely exploited, oil is in decline, coal is dirty,
> Japanese tsunami generated all that bad press for nuclear power.  Now I am
> convinced to steer my own investment dollars towards advanced domestic PV
> fabs.  After it is all said and done, I am convinced to my own satisfaction
> that PVs are the path forward, with load leveling being largely accomplished
> by using peak power for conversion of coal to octane and for electric
> power-intensive processes such as metal extraction.  Expensive, takes a long
> time to transition, lot of loss in transmission.  But considering all
> alternatives, the downsides don’t seem so far down now.
>
> spike

If you're talking PV, then I agree! Especially since they seem to be
on an exponential improvement path, unlike any other energy technology
(ever?).

But, why would you worry too much about losses in transmission? PV is
a decentralizing technology. Just put it where you need it, the grid
takes a back seat.

Ray K recently put forward a timeframe of 20 years until the world is
100% solar, based on current doubling time of uptake. Certainly, in 20
years there'll be a lot of it. Out the other side of that? Masses of
power, far more than now, with no concept of power use being a bad
thing. Bring it on!

-- 
Emlyn

http://my.syyn.cc - A service for syncing buzz and facebook, posts,
comments and all.
http://www.blahblahbleh.com - A simple youtube radio that I built
http://point7.wordpress.com - My blog
Find me on Facebook and Buzz