[ExI] greatest date in history

John Clark johnkclark at gmail.com
Tue Jul 5 17:28:48 UTC 2016

On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 2:29 AM, Adrian Tymes <atymes at gmail.com> wrote:

​>> ​
>> Freedom of speech and assembly covers a lot of ground, you can never list
>> all the things you can do with those freedoms and I don't think religious
>> speech is more important than other types of speech and if you have freedom
>> of speech you can use it to petition the Government for a redress of
>> grievances, so they shouldn't have been specifically mentioned.  ​
> ​> ​
> Keep in mind the times when it was written.  One could, back then,
> conceive of a government that took such petitions as the equivalent of
> shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theater:

​I don't think one should be allowed to ​shout anything in a crowded
theater except for fire if there really was a fire; you have a right to
speak but you don't have a right to make me listen. Incidentally that
metaphor came from a decision from Judge Oliver Wendell Holmes involving
those who spoke out against the USA being in the first world war, Holmes
later regretted it calling it the worst decision in his legal career. But
the saying lives on.


> ​> ​
> speech intended to be dangerous, and thus not falling under free speech
> protections.  Likewise, just because a state-sponsored religion hasn't been
> established does not itself prevent laws against practicing certain forms
> of religion

​As long as you could meet with like minded religious believers ​and speak
and write about your religion what would a law against that religion even
mean?  Yes somebody could claim (and unfortunately some have) that although
freedom of speech specifies that you can say anything it doesn't mean you
can say "*that*", but there are an infinite number of things you can say
and you can't list them all, so I see no reason religious speech and
activities should be singled out for special protection over and above all
other forms of speech and activities. And singling out religion is the
reason religious charities have rights that non-religious charities do not;
churches don't even have to file an application for recognition of
tax-exempt status as non-religious charities do, they get it automatically.
Also the IRS requires non-religious charities to file form 990 every year
detailing what they are doing with their money, but religious organizations
don't have to, nobody knows what they do with their money.

 John K Clark
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